It’s been called “Spain’s trial of the century”. Over a year since a controversial independence referendum, tensions are running high in Madrid’s Supreme Court as twelve Catalan separatist leaders are tried on accusations of rebellion, disobedience and the misuse of public funds. If convicted, they face sentences of up to 25 years in prison.
How did we get to this point? The Parliament of Catalonia unilaterally declared independence on 27th October 2017 after a controversial referendum deemed illegal by the Constitutional Court of Spain. Turnout during the referendum was reported to be 43%, with around 90% voting in favour of secession. Spanish police were heavily criticised at the time for instituting a violent crackdown at polling stations.
Supporters of independence argue that their language and culture is not sufficiently respected by the Spanish central government and they worry that, unless something is done, their culture will be absorbed. However, the Catalan independence movement also sees secession as an economic issue, spurred by the Great Recession in which Catalonia was one of the regions worst-affected by the crisis despite being the one of the wealthiest in the country. The combination of nationalism and economic interest has led to a regional disenchantment with the status quo, fuelling Spain’s biggest political crisis since its transition to democracy in the 1970s.
Do former Catalan government officials deserve to be imprisoned for their involvement in the independence referendum? Pro-independence groups advocate their right to self-determination, and cite Madrid as unwilling to open any dialogue or negotiation on the issue. They seek a more conciliatory approach to the question from the country’s capital and argue that sending their leaders to prison won’t solve anything.
Opponents of the independence movement, on the other hand, argue that the Catalan separatists did not follow the proper legal and constitutional process in the organisation of the referendum, in doing so broke the law, and therefore the results hold no legitimacy. For them it is the integrity of Spanish democracy and the 1978 Constitution that is at stake.
Should Catalan separatist leaders be found guilty of rebellion? Or was it wrong to even begin legal proceedings against them? Let us know your thoughts and comments in the form below and we’ll take them to policymakers and experts for their reactions!
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Yes, they are. The catalan right wing, Convergencia, has created all this circus just to be in charge. They were totally finished in 2012 and, suddenly, they waved the flag and many people started drooling and following them. They have ruined cataluña and only the Spanish government gives them money (their debt rating is one of the worst, by far, in the western world), but they have used that money, instead of improving the lifes of catalans, in a game where only them win.
They have created an illusion cheating people. Quite similar than brexit.
They should finish their days jailed for breaking a society for political interest.
so many lies .. Catalonia is always growing more than Spain
We don’t want Spanish money .. we want INDEPENDENCE so Spain can keep his money for them
Who is braking a society are the ones who deny the right of catalans to choose their future in or out of Spain
Improve your English and your maths,my dear. Catalonia, CATALUNYA, has been contributing to Spain far more than any other “region of Spain”. For decades. We, Catalan people,the tax-payers in this land which will soon become an Independent Republic from dreadful Franco-spain, want to be free and fairly so. We do not hate Spain. We are neighbours and we share history. But we have our own language,culture and place in history. Please, let us choose what we want to do. MOST OF US here want to quit Spain. Can you understand that?
This is not an issue for Debate.
Spain has Laws and a Constitution, Catalunya is a part of Spain, so the Spanish Justice will do her job according to the Spanish Laws and Constitution.
If the Catalan separatists Leaders violated the Laws of Spain they are guilty if they didn’t they are innocent. Simple as that
The judicial system in Spain is full of corrupted judges playing the game together with the oligarchs, the same familys since the time of Franco’s dictatorship. They want to solve the issue of the civil and political rigths of catalan citizens with the “penal code of the enemy” instead of starting a real dialogue. They are afraid of democratic standards.
Which law was broken? A vast majority of Catalans wanted to vote and they did. Under the rain and brutal bashing of Spanish Police ans military men. There is nothing wrong in voting in a so-called DEMOCRACY! WE SHALL NOT FORGET OR FORGIVE what happened to us on THE FIRST OF OCTOBER!
Ariis,”this is not an issue for debate”: this exactly what the Spain’s problem is, and what has led to this travesty of justice with Catalonia – the lack oapacity/will of the representatives of the Spanish Government to establish a dialogue with the government of Catalonia.And let us not forget that laws do not always represent Justice; if they did, women would not have needed to die to gain for others the simple right to vote,or black Americans to fight for basic human rights. The truth is seldom pure, and never simple.
Since when a “rebellion” is held by a referendum? 🤣
The Catalan crisis only further exposes the eroded democracy in EU.
Inform yourself beforehand, they are not about to carry out an illegal and unconstitutional referendum. but for declaring the Catalan republic and skipping the Spanish constitution and using the institutions and the power of its government to carry it out.
Defenetly yes!
What do you gain exactly by ruling over other people against their will? Is it some kind of satisfaction? Do you get any material benefits out of it?
why ? For showing their democratic preferences ?
are you claiming they didn’t do what they’re accused of?
I’m asking what benefit it gives Spaniards to rule over Catalans against the latter’s wishes.
that’s for them to judge that.
Regardless, what they were doing is illegal. If they actualy want independance they need to convince the other Spanish to change the constitution (wich shouldn’t be too hard, plenty of other separatist movements in Spain).
What they did is a big no no in any country and in most, i’m preaty sure they would be far more strict with the separatists).
Just to give some perspective, it took Scotland 20 odd years to get their referendum
AUTODETERMINATION IS INCLUDED IN INTERNATIONAL TREATIES SIGNED BY SPAIN
What benefit do you get by ruling over Catalans?
When and where can be illegal a referendum???? Are we talking about democracy??? What is the basis of democracy??? People participation thought referendum!!!!!
Inform yourself beforehand, they are not about to carry out an illegal and unconstitutional referendum. but for declaring the Catalan republic and skipping the Spanish constitution and using the institutions and the power of its government to carry it out.
States should only govern with the consent of the governed. Any rule not based on that principle is tyranny, essentially.
No.
No. They acted on a basic human right of self-determination, demanded by 80% of Catalans.
👉 Solidarity with Catalonia – for the right to peaceful self-determination!
https://chn.ge/2uu1Lhs
if they do not follow the constitutional procedures…
Constitutional procedures should help citizens. Not make things difficult.
If there aren’t proper constitutional procedures…
Constitutional procedures are there to provide stability and avoid abuse by populists. That’s why it’s usually hard to change a constitution. Because it involves many people and interests.
One question the Spanish Penal Code doesnt says anyting about making an unauthorised referendum.
Implying that wanting Catalan independence means being populist.
Do you believe that if catalans had voted NO in 78 to the Constitution of Franco chosen monarch , the independence would be given then ??!
White star Catalonian separatists learned that Democracy and independence is a myth. The EU didn’t support them, the West didn’t support them and the Left wing numbskulls don’t really understand whether the Catalonian separatists are Leftists or right wingers.
the Catalan leaders will be condemned if their presumption of innocence can be distorted.
The really important thing is: Did they act under the premises of democracy or did they use democracy to bypass the laws of a state of law?
freedom of speech and information
What freedom? that one that is only of an ideology
That’s for the judges to decide. It’s funny how people try to sway the justice system and in the same breath talk about democracy. If there is no separation of the political system from the judicial system, it isn’t democracy. People need to properly educate themselves before letting emotions and things that may appear unjust on the surface get in the way of rational and impartial thought.
Definitely yes. They violated the constitution, which was approved by all Spanish citizens in a referendum in 1978 and, on top of this, gives ample autonomy to all regions.
The situation has changed. Things are not or should not be unmovable.
Maybe, but change cannot and should not be done unilaterally. The issue of secession should include everyone in a nation state, not only by a group of people claiming to represent a region.
what violation ? Freedom of speech and information allows them ask for the opinion of catalans
Do you believe that if catalans had voted NO in 76 the independence would be given then ???!
They may ask, but that doesn’t give them the right to call a referendum and proclaim independence based on some result which cannot be verified properly,
If they had voted no, or boycotted the referendum, the constitution would not have been adopted.
Civis you, were you voting that Constitution ? By age I don’t think so.
A Constitution is not the Holy Bible and your politicians have chaged it when they have wanted to. Don’t argue with such megalies !
Up with the Republic of Catalonia, a free State ! !
||\*/||
Nonsense. People was forced to vote between Franco rules or a mix of stupid rules decided among Franco followers and corrupted politicians pretending to be a democratic law… And I can notice you have no idea about that almost anybody that voted at the 70ies is dead. You are welcome ;) ;) ;)
so the options were geopardized … Or that shity Constitution or keeping the fascism… EXTORTION
The ones who boycotted the Referéndum were the Spanish
🤣🤣 thats the dumbest thing ive heard so far ” ALL people should vote if a minorety group has freedom” 🤣 its like expecting the soviet union to allow a forced member state to leave the union based on the votes of the entire union🤣
First of all i’ts a shame that they are being judged in a trial that’s is conducted by a bunch of corrupted criminals
If the Referendum was illegal it was illegal fine, however Spain refuses to offer a legal Referendum. The people want to vote but you say NO, so they had to force this vote, and Spain responded with violence against ordinary people using their democratic and human rights to self determination. And this is the same Spain that calls democratically elected Venezuelan President Maduro a dictator.
Shame on spanish justice
They are being judge, mainly, and therefore the crime of rebellion, for declaring independence, not because referendum.
Voting for the independence of a part of the territory is prohibited in all countries of the world, which have a Constitution. They had several warnings from constitutional judge about not doing that, but they did already, and they used public money and resources for it.
Finally, They are being judge because they broke the law, by spanish justice, that it is independent from political influence.
Really? Did you ever read the UK constitution? Or the Canadian one? I don’t think so
Yes, of course: rebellion and misappropriation.
Germany and Belgium already said there was NO rebellion.
Why did the Catalan constituents vote no or abstain from contemplating the right of self-determination of the Spanish peoples in the Spanish Constitution of 1978?
The catalan secesionists live of lies. If there was not freedom they would not be able to do what they do.
The catalan separatis leaders ignore the majority of catalan people that are not separatist! These politicians are liars that are playing an endless performance.
Exactamente, quieren seguir robando como los Pujol pero sin necesitar que en Madrid hagan la vista gorda. No entiendo como casi la mitad del pueblo catalán está bajo el Síndrome de Estocolmo de los que les han robado durante toda la democracia porque antes Franco lo único que hizo fue favorecerlos junto a los vascos.
Our politicians just did what we, the people, demanded. I see here a lot of remarks that are based on wrong information from spanish mass media. The media in Spain are all corrupted. Even more we the independance supporters try always to contrast our sources of information.
You just need to google the amount of investment disputes that Spain has in the World Bank (higher than Argentina or Venezuela) to realise that its higher courts are NOT inpartial. The higher courts have just been condoning retroactive changes on legislation for years.
So of course this is a political trial.
Forget Brexit,the Gillets jaunes,Orban or the nutty Italian government this is the scandal that everyone should be outraged by.
In the twenty first century a so called European democracy is putting twelve political prisoners on trial for treason.There only ‘crime’ was to ask the citizens of their region if they wanted to be a free and independent nation.Can you imagine the comments(especially on this site) if the British government imprisioned the leaders of the Scottish nationalists or the Canadian government did the same to the Quebec separatists.Both those governments held free and fair referendums and abided by the result,but not this quasi third world dictatorship that’s just masquerading as a democracy.And the fact that the EU as taken no action against Spain is a mark of how far into the sewer this continent as sunk.
They should be free!!
Which law was broken? A vast majority of Catalans wanted to vote and they did. Under the rain and brutal bashing of Spanish Police ans military men. There is nothing wrong in voting in a so-called DEMOCRACY! WE SHALL NOT FORGET OR FORGIVE what happened to us on THE FIRST OF OCTOBER!
Should Catalan separatist leaders be found guilty of rebellion?
Do away with social evolution you mean?
Now that will stultify European society until the only answer is revolution on all fronts. Revolution is civil war. And, I would have thought the last 50 years or so, where the peoples of this continent have been manipulated by narrow thinking politicians, with ill thought through ideology, would have learned from their experience of prolonged indoctrination and what it has already created.
However, the lack of insight is mind boggling in all our 27 States politicians. They simply do not develop an understanding of social movement and change. Take the fools in the UK who claim they are setting up a new party whilst rejecting their own ideologies within those they have clung to for ions. When all they are truly doing is trying to resurrect Blairism. The one thing the general population has rejected full on. These clowns are running for cover, as they are so fully indoctrinated with globalist views, they cannot bear to face the new horizon. The one they can’t survive in.
Yes, the people are crying out for a return to their history politically, but, not that of the Blairite kind. It is the tradition of their heritage they long for. In the UK, it is a return to the principles of British decency. The Attlee project, Aneurin Bevan, true social justice thinking.and acting They want English principles, the NHS, Grammar schools, tradition, fairness. Not diversity, based on special treatment for some at the expense of their taxes and loss of their ability to thrive and protect their family. Blair is a globalist. And his policies are austerity, except for financiers and oligarchs who make sure he gets his laundered money gifts.The same kind so many of our so called Liberal Democrats are coming into as we write. Nick Clegg with his 7 million pound Beverly Hills house and the job at Face book, based on his collusion with Cameron to rob the citizen of their sovereignty. What a fix. All of these so called ‘new Independent party’ workers are paid up members of the EU, one way or the other. Staunch Bilderberger minions all of them. Telling the public, we are here to give you more of what you hate. Cling onto it with all your might, it’s just what you need. Tony is behind us. And, Soros has the money for us to lead you right across the precipice.
Additionally, at the same time as condemning Brexit and insisting we have another ‘peoples vote’ for Democracy, wait for it, they refuse to face their own constituents in order to get a mandate for this new perspective they envision within a wider EU for us all. Democracy doesn’t come into that side of their argument, as they know full well their constituents want them out of their fraudulently taken seat as soon as yesterday. Except for Chuckie baby, his seat is built on a huge majority of immigrant voters, and he knows how to seal the kiss of that crowd, being the son of one.
Ask the honest reason Catalans want to be free of Spain. It isn’t because they are happy being part of them is it? And to make their leaders into criminals will only lead to others taking their place. This rebellion, as you see it, comes from the bottom up, not the top down.
YES
OF COURSE!!!
No
No
No.
Yes, of course!
Go to jail and that’s all
Of course no!!!!🎗🎗🎗🎗🎗🎗🎗🎗🎗🎗🎗🎗
Absolutely not. Rebellion, in the Spanish Criminal Code requires violence. Violence cannot be substantiate unless deliberately misleading interpretation of facts prevails in Court.
Catalonia triumphant
Shall again be rich and bountiful.
Drive away these people,
Who are so conceited and so contemptuous.
Strike with your sickle!
Strike with your sickle, defenders of the land!
Strike with your sickle!
Now is the time, reapers.
Now is the time to stand alert.
For when another June comes,
Let us sharpen our tools well.
Strike with your sickle!
Strike with your sickle, defenders of the land!
Strike with your sickle!
In pris om with the separatistas
Viva Espania !
No
Nooo
Help Catalonia!!
Free
Definitely yes. They violated the constitution, which was approved by all Spanish citizens in a referendum in 1978 and, on top of this, gives ample autonomy to all regions
Violated the constitution, so if all are equal before the law they should be.
NO at all!🎗
Only pro independence Catalans defending the “NO” to this question. They are ridiculous.
No, first of all because making illegal referendums is not an offense since 2005, second, because Spain knows our program. Third, because, if independence is illegal, why did they let us to contest the elections?
Somos un país y conseguiremos salir de la Espanya fascista. VIVA LA REPUBLICA DE CATALUNYA. SEGUIMOS
Spain is a fascist state!