On paper we’ve achieved equal rights. Perhaps that’s why feminism is seen as such a dirty word or, at least, the reason why some people seem to struggle with the term (including the world’s most powerful woman, German Chancellor Angela Merkel). To be a ‘feminist’ is to support equality, human dignity and self-determination for women. What could be objectionable in that?
For some people, however, the pendulum has already swung too far in the opposite direction. For example, girls already perform better than boys in school, including achieving the best exam results. They should, in theory, also have the strongest start in their careers. Yet this is, unfortunately, often where the success stories ends. Whether it’s in terms of salary, the division of jobs, or career opportunities, men are doing better. Only one in three management positions in the EU are filled by a woman and she will, on average, earn only three-quarters of what her male counterpart earns. These aren’t the only problems. Sexual abuse and harassment in the public sphere, at work, and at home has only recently been brought to light by the #MeToo debate.
What do our readers think? We had a comment sent in by Anna, who argues that feminism may have been important in the past but that it’s work today is largely finished. She accepts that there are still problems with equality in other parts of the world, but in her opinion there certainly aren’t in Europe.
To get a reaction, we put Anna’s comment to Ann Widdecombe, a former British politician in the Conservative party and author. Does she agree with Anna that gender equality only really needs to be fought for outside of Europe?
Yes, I would agree with that 100%, particularly given how today’s feminism has developed. Now, where she is absolutely right there is to make a distinction between the West and the rest of the world. Now the rest of the world, you still do desperately need of feminism – or in some of it – but not in the West. And the thing that saddens me is the battles of feminism in the seventies – of which I was part – was all about ‘give us the same opportunities as the men and we’ll show you we’re as good, if not better.’ Now, it’s not about ‘give us a level playing field,’ but ‘give us a playing field that’s tilted towards us.’ Things like all women short-lists, for example, or quotas on boards. That’s almost as if we’re saying ‘Oh dear, after all these decades, we couldn’t make it; now we have to have special measures.’ That, to me, is an admission of failure and it’s not true feminism. To me, feminism has always been about competing with a man on equal terms, not having your path artificially smoothed.
To get another perspective, we also put the same comment to Jennifer Baumgardner, a feminist writer, filmmaker, activist, and Executive Director/Publisher of the Feminist Press at the City University of New York (CUNY) from 2013 to 2017. Would she agree with Anna’s point?
No, I think it’s pretty obviously false. But I also understand how frustrating it is to have to operate – there was this moment in the ‘70s when feminism globally, and especially in the West, had this tremendous impact and was really visible. That sort of crystallised our view of what feminism is and certainly the world has changed for women a ton since then: in terms of their integration into the workplace, in terms of men being equal partners in the home – or closer to that – and then most profoundly in terms of how we look at gender. For younger person, gender is so much more on a spectrum or a non-binary approach.
I think the way we talked about feminism 40 years has some validity today, but it’s absolutely a different conversation, with different words, but because we’re still using this word that has symbolic valences of the past, I think it can feel frustrating for people to talk about the world as if nothing’s changed, when things have changed profoundly. So, I think both things are true. I absolutely that women aren’t even – in all sorts of way of measuring it – on equal footing with men.
And vice versa. There are things where men are unfairly policed, and women have more freedom: I think in the realm of emotions and tenderness and things like that; the ability to be seen as legitimate as a caregiver. That’s an area where women are seen as legitimate as a parent or a caregiver and men are not if that’s their main job.
So I think there are all sorts of work we can do as a community and as humanity, but this word ‘feminism’ is really elastic and I think you, as an individual, calling yourself a ‘feminist’ have to know what it means to you. It isn’t this sort of static entity outside of us, it’s this personal, elastic term that you take on and make meaningful in your life.
Next up, we had a comment from Julian, who sees the threat of a reactionary backlash against feminism from today’s populist parties. He argues that sexism and discrimination is still ever-present in Europe, and that we should be careful not to take our achievements for granted. Is he right?
How would Ann Widdecombe respond?
And actually, if you ask me about gender inequality, I would now say it’s the men who’ve got the real grievance. I mean, if you take for example, all women short-lists for Parliament – let’s just take that as one example – then you’ve got a man who’s grown up in a constituency, educated his own children there, used the local health services, knows it backwards, but can’t apply because it’s reserved for a woman. Now think what would happen if that the reversed were approved. Men are certainly at a disadvantage in some of the legal positions. We’ve seen it a lot recently, whereby a man is named the moment there is an investigation, doesn’t even wait until he’s charged; the woman remains anonymous throughout, even if she’s falsely accused him. Men are at a disadvantage in the family courts, where the presumption is nearly always with the women. So, don’t tell me we have gender inequality against women. If anything, it’s now against poor guys.
And what would Jennifer Baumgardner say to the same argument?
We’re in this moment of profound threats and now people aren’t feeling so complacent about feminism, but we’re in a worst spot than we would’ve been had we not been so complacent in the first place, where we said, ‘Well, I don’t love everything about Hillary Clinton.’ But it would be meaningful to have the first female President. It’s also kind of progressive. We made these choices as a country that reveals our underlying misogyny and our underlying lack of faith in equality. Now we’re dealing the reality of that.
Finally, we had a comment from Catherine, who is fiercely opposed to feminism. She argues that feminists are really “anti-female”, and that they “pretend” there are no differences based on gender. She thinks feminists tell women they can “have it all” and be loving mothers while pursuing a successful career, when the reality is that they must choose. Does she have a point?
What does Ann Widdecombe think?
And how would Jennifer Baumgardner reply to Catherine?
So, I don’t that it’s anti-mother, but certainly that relationship is a fraught space, because there was a time when that was only role that was listed up for woman. To this day, I do think if you don’t have kids as a woman, there’s this kind of ‘raised eyebrow’ at you that you didn’t fulfil your destiny, or something’s weird about you. So the fact that feminism was trying to create a space for women not to be mothers can be misunderstood as demeaning mothers. Some puncturing of the mystique of the concept of motherhood had to happen to create any space for women not to choose that.
Do we still need feminism? Has equality between the genders been fully achieved in Europe today? Or is inequality and discrimination still deeply entrenched within society? Why is there so much hostility to the term “feminism”? Let us know your thoughts and comments in the form below and we’ll take them to policymakers and experts for their reactions!
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110 comments Post a commentcomment
Various strands of feminism out there.
Exactly.
Only if the goal of humanity is to commit suicide. Show me a feminist & I will show you a man hater.
Ah cmon bro. Plently of manhaters, its true, but havent we given them plenty of reason? Rape, rape and rape throughout history… And now in the West its beter but life sucks being a muslim, african or asian women. Even for the rich ones in most cases, ok. So now the liberated women are abusing their privilige . Isnt that logical? They have no culture, no historical rolemodels, etc. Still i think its the opposite bro. Not putting women in power is suicide. Would muslim countries be at war if women ruled them? Would african countries? And the big demographic explosion in Africa which definetly threatens europe in the next 50 years. Maybe you fear women bro, and i understand you, but why not give them a chance? We know what happens if men rule the world in any case…. (Hitler, stalin, etv. All men)
Well done for the standard socialist BS dogma comrade but the reality is the vast majority of men would kill rapists, in the West wars are fought by men to protect women and children & I like most men would give my life to protect a woman so to claim I am afraid of women is ludicrous, idiotic, lazy thinking but mostly sexiest..
Ps. Please do not call me ‘bro’, I chose my friends very carefully.
This discussion is very long but well worth a watch so please educate yourself.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Xc7DN-noAc
So feminist = manhater?
The crazier feminists get the more real women reject them & it’s not hard to see why.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/life/only-7-per-cent-of-britons-consider-themselves-feminists/
Thanks, I needed that laugh today!
Goodbye inoffensive comment, hello EU Article 13 dictatorship. 8|
that’s a really uninformed opinion. feminists want equal rights, not the destruction of men.
Yes. But more second wave and less third wave
Not any more…in all this time women would have assimilate all principle that characterized feminist principle…. now we just need to support new feminism arisen from poor countries with restrict mentality…
So in short yes. Women in less fortunate circumstances are the ones who need help more than ever
Yes But not the help of new feminism of occidental….we have to help them with the same principle that former feminists had protest against society in 1930-40-50-60-70
nope
S**t like this is why we still need feminism.
THANK YOU!!
There is no logical reason for feminism, women already have equal rights which is not stating that everyone is equal because that would mean a utopia which is not possible. Y’all have equal rights just most of y’all are to spoiled or or uneducated to see the truth, and that why real problems now a days are seen as joke because of people like you.
Woman, have more power than men as of now thus making femenism just a way to brag there supiriority
Some feminists don’t want equality, they want to disadvantage men, they hate men.
then they aren’t feminists
But women already have equal rights, so if they aren’t feminist because they are hating on men then whats the point of your belief.
Well I lack to see what rights women don’t have in Europe anymore and if they talk about gender pay gap then that’s already been debunked for years, so really any feminist that talks about gender pay gap isn’t really educated and is pretty much going to be a man hater.
My issue is, feminism is to support everyone. It is still legal to pay those with disabilities less than minimum wage.
Without reading the article
.. yes. Rights are maintained and improved because people advocate them every day. As soon as you stop defending something that is already in place, it will be discredited and put on the back burner unless there is money involved
Name one law or right men have that women don’t, just one.
You didn’t answer the question. Laws are useless if they’re not enforced, which continues to happen, not just against women. Naming a law is a stupid thing to ask me, and your demand is exemplary. Asking women to bear the burden of proof, when it’s up to you to do your own research. And a law where? In Europe? France? England ? Where?
Ivan, to tell you the truth, look in places like Saudi Arabia where women are killed even when they just hold hands with a man. They can be put to treason and go on trial for showing their hair.
Is that enough? I bet you wouldn’t want every inch of skin on your body covered it sweltering 100 degree weather, would you?
To the Unknown character, these accusations about Saudi are quite incorrect. Living in the middle east (You’d be surprised about where I live in the Middle East), occurrences like this are rare. I think what you are attempting to criticize is Capital Punishment. However, this does not come with simply displaying your hair. Murder, Adultery and topics surrounding these issues SHOULD have serious consequences as it means that what many people would say “nips it in the bud”. Capital Punishment acts as a deterrence against such issues. Having said that, I do not agree with Capital Punishment as there are better forms of sentencing such as life in prison. In addition to this, not being able to show your hair is a complete lie. Again, by living in such an area, women are allowed to show their hair as said by the Crown Prince himself. (https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/middle-east/women-in-saudi-arabia-do-not-need-to-wear-head-cover-says-crown-prince-1.3433096)
Anon it may not happen all the time, but the ruling is still in place. Women are allowed to be punished for showing ridiculous amounts of body. Also you said Laudatory should be able to be punished and you put it on the same pedastool as Murder. I think this is a little ridiculous and religiously advocated since Adultery is a thought crime that only exists for God.
To NK
I think you are right to say that the rulings are there, but in the context of the previous message I had replied to, showing your hands is not a crime and women will not be condemned for showing hair. That was a lie. To address your last point on adultery, to use the word ONLY for this is quite strong. Do you think that a married atheist couple likes getting cheated on? I would hope not because what you are insinuating is that adultery is perfectly fine for people who are not religious because and I quote “Adultery is a thought crime that only exists for God”. Surely this is not right because I know that most of my atheist colleagues would hate to be cheated on. On laudatory, may I ask if you are referring to religious praise or am I misinterpreting this?
I don’t understand how this “debate” can even be a thing. Here are but a few reasons as to why we need feminism:
– Not all women around the world have the same opportunities and rights as men.
– Societal expectations have raised women (and men) to believe that a large portion of their worth is determined by their appearance.
– Societal expectations have raised women (and men) to expect certain types of submissive behaviour of women, such as “nourishing” and “timid”, while words like “protector” and “strong” is more reserved for those that just happen to have dangly bits between their legs.
– Male privilege is alive and thriving.
– Women are catcalled and harassed on the street.
– Sexual harassment is also common in the workplace or at school.
– Rape and sexual assault cases aren’t taken seriously. Exhibit A: when the world elects a sexual harasser as the president, you need feminism…
– Men suffer from psychological problems that are more likely to kill them, because they’re seen as “weak” and “emotional”, coincidentally “feminine” traits (load of rubbish), if they seek help openly. Why should men commit suicide over the prospect of being found “girly”? Is that worse than death? What does that tell you about internalised misogyny and how women are viewed.
– There is a lack of women in certain fields and in leadership roles.
– The government makes decisions about women’s bodies.
– The wage gap. It IS a thing, and more faceted than you think. Do not dismiss it simply as per hearsay. Read.SEVERAL.academic.articles.
– “Woman” or “girl” is used as a derogatory term to insult people one finds to be of lesser worth, bad at something, or beneath you.
There is so much more that is problematic on how women are represented, conditioned, and treated by society. Patriarchy isn’t even beneficial for men, and feminists do NOT hate men. We fight for men as well, for EVERYONE to have it better. How is that so bad?
.
An interesting list most of which can be explained by biological & temperament differences between the sexes, cultural & religious differences across the world and Socialist dogma via intersectional politics.
The only issue I would ask about is your assertion that ‘The government makes decisions about women’s bodies’, who do you want to make those decisions & if you are referring to abortion why does your right to control your own body supersede the rights of the unborn child to life ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k-AHLibO2rQ
Explained, perhaps. Excused and justified, never.
If abortion is banned, women who do not want a child will be forced to have one. Children will be born unwanted. Sometimes, they may be walking reminders of rape, even. It takes two to make a child, but most of the time, the unwanted child becomes the sole responsibility of the mother, whose life it ruins, especially if the mother is a teenager. Her and her child’s prospect will be grim, at best, often costing tax payers more and contributing to overpopulation. If the unborn mush of non-sentient cells has a right to “life”, doesn’t the mother? The child and the mother may live under horrendous social and economic circumstances, that none of them chose to be in. To me, that’s not really a “life”…
Also, when does sentient human life even begin? Most abortions take place in the first part of the trimester, when a fetus is attached by the placenta and umbilical chord to the mother, thus, its health relies on the mother and it cannot be regarded a separate entity as it cannot exist outside of her womb. And if fertilised eggs used for IV are thrown away (as so many are), is that also abortion?
Whether you agree or not with abortion, if abortion is banned, it will still not stop being practiced. All that will happen is that thousands upon thousands of women will die, because it will be done in unsafe ways. Banning abortions is condemning women to die, and I don’t understand how there is an argument against that particular point no matter what stance you have on the matter.
What do you mean with “socialist dogma”? What would you consider a right worthy of protection?
‘Explained, perhaps. Excused and justified, never’ ? Even when the explanation is based on facts & science as opposed to the way a few people feel ? Seriously ?
Hospitals across the world are full of people who can not survive on their own so should we kill them too ?
Care homes across the world are full of people who can not survive on their own so should we kill them too ?
Billions of children under 16 across the world can not survive on their own so should we kill them too ?
Attempting to justify mass murder because its inconvenient is an incredibly bad Indictment on Western culture and even more so on women.
Maybe women taking a little personnel responsibly would work equally as well…. or you could just blame men.
Samuel Byström There are many rights worthy of protecting chief of which is the right to life, without it you have nothing worth protecting..
Socialism ‘always’ leads to the same result, death.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQqnNqVDlig
Did you seriously just ignore everything I pointed out? Opting out by ridiculing? By your own logic, banning abortion would be the last thing we should do, because, we already have enough people to take care of that we can’t take care of. Not sure how pointing that out even speaks in your favour.
Why do anti-abortionists only care about life until it’s born?
Anyway, say whatever you want, because when it comes down to it, really, there is no banning abortion; there is only legal and illegal abortion. If we do as you would prefer, it’s a death sentence for women. And that is a fact.
Kicki , let’s just disengage. He’s nothing but a “pro lifer”. His identity is built around a lie about red pills regarding female oppression of men and ‘actual truths’ about the sanctity of potential while disregarding the rights of the actual.
Nothing more to see.
Samuel (<-- Troll) It's a seriously screwed world when saying that valuing life over some woman's inability to control themselves is seen as a bad thing, but in your case not having children is probably a good thing for the human race. Thanks for your SJW virtual signalling though, however meaningless it was. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G_sGn6PdmIo
Hahahaha “Their inability to control themselves”? Really? It’s not that simple and you MUST know that. PLEASE don’t tell me you’re that retarded. For starters, contraception doesn’t always work, and many women don’t get to have a say in when men exploit their bodies for pleasure anyway, which can result in pregnancy. If you cannot see why it would be wrong to force something they do not want upon someone, especially in those situations, you are not only a disgrace to your sex, but walking proof that we need feminism, still. I cannot argue with someone who is not even open to listen, even though they were the ones asking a question to begin with. That is why I will not reply further. Good day.
Please explain me then why the heck you fight for killing girls with abortion and why do you need same rights as men you women are different, men’s are better at their things and women are better in their things
Kicki If it doesn’t work for you but it does for billions of other people maybe you are the retarded one comrade 8| Have you tried reading the instructions ?
If you can’t see why killing babies is wrong clearly you should not have the privilege of having one. Kill a child outside the womb & go to prison for a very long time, kill a child in the womb & get to pat yourself on the back as a poor hard done to victim of the none existent male hierarchy. The women of the 1% enjoying their privilege while claiming victim hood is quite pathetic.
The Wage gap does not exist as it has been disproved many times, if you do the equal work you get equal pay and i’m not directing that to just women that goes to everyone that believes in “White Male Privilege”
Judy is a woman I identify with. Feminists do not work for women.They work for pseudo women who want to take on a male persona. I am not one of them. And never want to be. From a feminist ideology It is seriously against the rights of women to be female reasoned and respected for that female persona they enjoy. Feminists work on promoting women to emulate men and pretend they love being that way. They don’t. And women do not find satisfaction trying to shed their natural sense of well being the way they have been pushed to believe.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=71TsgQavVkM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wJkFQohIKNI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmhxLQLFqh8
Judy is a woman I identify with. Feminists do not work for women.They work for pseudo women who want to take on a male persona. I am not one of them. And never want to be. From a feminist ideology It is seriously against the rights of women to be female reasoned and respected for that female persona they enjoy. Feminists work on promoting women to emulate men and pretend they love being that way. They don’t. And women do not find satisfaction trying to shed their natural sense of well being the way they have been pushed to believe.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=71TsgQavVkM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wJkFQohIKNI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmhxLQLFqh8
We never needed this political delusion called ‘Feminism’ as it has been presented. We need women who knew how to work political o raise the stature and needs by understanding and admiring genuine female differences in their nature. Not an idealism that doesn’t even want to acknowledge it exists.
Gee never needed it and we will never need it
The Feminism vs Masculism political war” in the West is a fight of relativity.
Prevailing 1st to 3rd world differences in Asia & Africa in that respect are enormous and still a long way to be resolved. “Civilizing” the world- including both genders- on many levels is an ongoing evolutionary process- everywhere.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masculism
At least all aggrieved genders have access to a quasi functioning court of law in Europe. This rule applies to everyone. Below that- go work it out!
Reproduction rates in Europe are alarmingly low. Women on the streets and on barricades should be unnecessary. Both pro & anti abortionists have a point. Governments need to consider both.
Suggestion:
Services like public health, education & security etc are state (all tax payers) sponsored. The result of social “mishaps”- like naive & reckless sexual indulgences- causing unwanted pregnancies should be “sensibly considered & regulated”- by all sovereign states- not the EU.
Today, enough education and preventative means are available for every responsible person (both genders) to avoid unwanted pregnancies. Those failing (both- takes 2) have to carry the pleasant or unpleasant (also financial) consequences. Juveniles are the (financial) responsibility of their parents. That’s life!
Legal abortion should & must be granted by a panel of doctors for women with (serious) medical conditions after careful considerations. All other unwanted babies (incl. from repeat “offenders”) must be born, handed over to state to be professionally cared for and/or offered for adoption eventually.
The law should never allow abortion (legal killings) on demand by immature and irresponsible- would- or would not be parents. Forget the “when life begins” argument/excuse. Ethically it remains @ conception.
The state can/must contribute “to up” the low EU birth rate and banish any sinister thoughts in its immigration policy. Rather spend the (tax) money on pro life for ones own citizens, instead on “burials of the dead & innocent” of mistakes by the Immature’s. Nor waste it on immigration experiments with unknown outcomes.
Do we still need feminism?
This added link is what ‘feminism’ and the ‘equalities’ action has produced. Of course it is denied, but. this is how men really feel. The only men who pick up with women who believe they are capable of shooting their own snakes are desperately in need of mothering themselves. Only men who have the persona of a ‘Peter Pan’ is interested in being second class citizen in the house he is trying to be head of. That is why, today, women constantly feel deserted, anxious and needy. No matter the position they find themselves in at their employment level. And this horrendous situation has grown out of all proportion under this so called ‘Feminist’ movement.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uoFoZwYgew8
I repeat ‘feminism’ is a ‘male’ or ‘masculine’ promotional organisation. And they are too ignorant intellectually to understand the root to satisfying the psyche of either man or woman, or, indeed the children they produce. Which leads to total dissatisfaction in every level of the human condition.
What we ‘all’ need is a movement that is equipped with a knowledge of how nature has chosen to create gender satisfaction in order to fulfil the needs of the
human condition. As, you cannot better the lot of one gender without also bettering the lot of the other. It has to be a joint movement for it to have any purposeful effect.
Successful women and men in the community are those who do not offer their sexual aspects. Unfortunately, the type of cover – whether male or female – has made the human reality of a person marginalized. Women and men have a community role that they can perform in terms of their physical capacity. Appropriate coverage makes humanity a consideration, not gender.
We cannot always use how many women are occupied senior/leadership posts to determine inequality exists still. Why can’t we see that many women prefer to sacrifice their career for their children. If I am the boss, I of course would promote a man who can dedicate all his time in his career rather than a woman who have children. More importantly, I do not see how woman can fully devoted to their children if she has a full time job. As a woman, if we want our children be brought up the way we wish and dedicate more time to take care our children, we have to give up other things that are less important such as career.
As we can see in modern society, woman are better educated and have also themselves a very good career. However, many women have also missed the chance to find a partner. So, equality is not having the law to be distorted so that woman can have everything including to replace man. It is always a matter of choice, what to give up and what to pursue. By blaming the society, blaming others and going to the street, woman can only show their strength is insufficient to master their own destination.
When women are still proud of their husband and their children’s success, please forget equality. Because women are required to support their love ones and sacrifice is required. It is a matter of choice. Once our own choice is made, do not blame others that we cannot have everything.
No I think that we don’t need feminism in America they have equal rights the wage gap is not real we don’t live in a patriarchal. Society and few questions why do you think all men are rapist why do you want to kill all men why do you hate men yeah there are some bad men but there are also bad women you need men or when you all die the human race is extinct we need both men and women we don’t need feminism in America we need feminism in country’s like sadi Arabia Islam is the least feminist religion go help the women’s there
No it’s quite useless nowadays. Thank you for reading me.
what about in south africa and the middle east? thank you for reading me
What about South Africa?
That is quite a strange country to choose but nonetheless useless. Being a native South African, feminism is really not needed. There are PLENTY of women in the workforce, working just as well as a man would. To reference the ‘Middle East’ is also a broad generalization. Some of these surely need to work out equality issues but not the ‘Middle East’
feminism is the equality of the sexes. meaning that not only women benefit from it. i think we won’t need it when i can walk in the mall alone without being called at, or walk in a parking lot and feel safe, or jog while wearing headphones, or when male sexual assault victims get justice too
yeah bro we still need feminism
feminism=pro women
just because women support themselves doesn’t mean that they disregard men. feminism is pro women, not anti men. we just want to be able to live up to men, and not always be second place. and if there is a feminist who is anti men, then she isn’t a feminist.
also, feminism is just the radical idea that women are humans too.
:)
i can give several examples of why we still need feminism
1). countries like saudi arabia, iraq and iran, and many and most countries in the middle east don’t give women a chance. they will put women on trial for showing their ankles and hair, not even to mention the 102 degree weather.
2). if we are truly equal, why are our payments not? if a woman works just as hard as a man, for equal amounts of time and the same job, guaranteed that the man will be paid more.
3). female products are very costly, too costly. if companies want to increase their prices and make products that are expensive but cheap to make, then our jobs better pay us to make it fair.
does that educate you enough?
you are wrong
why is this even an argument.
everyone saying that we don’t need it is just another reason to need it……
also i can 102% guarantee that everyone saying that is a white male..
You can’t say anything right now assuming randoms like that. And people are saying we don´t need it is because it is true state one fact on why we do.
Why is being white a bad thing? I am not white and I certainly do not think that you slandering ‘white men’ is what feminism stands for correct? If you are really a feminist, you would delegate with your feminists, express your opinions and concerns as well as giving a platform to ANYBODY who would like to agree or disagree. Just because they do not agree with you means that that opinion is ‘hate speech’ or ‘sexist’. These debates are what create a progressive society and individuals who oppress ANY voice can surely not call themselves a feminist.
Most women nowadays unfortunately are real feminists and very horrible as well. And back in the old days which most women were certainly Real Ladies. What in the world happened to these very pathetic loser women nowadays?
MGTOW…….
feminism is definitely needed because some women in the world are treated badly and unfairly whereas men get the upper hand
That’s not everywhere all because there are a few bad men doesn’t mean we need a whole new idea of political norms. Society’s just made over social standards, not rights. If you do mention the rights women have those too, all the ones men have. P.S. The wage gap doesn’t exist according to the 1963 equal pay act and 2010 equal pay act, and of course there are still companies still doing it and they can be charged, sued, and have to pay the plaintiffs attorney fees, Also I am 14.
feminism.
Yes Feminism is needed in 3rd world countries but in developed countries is it truly needed?
Feminism is not needed in most western countries in the slightest. Feminism is defined as the advocacy of women’s rights on the basis of the equality of the sexes, so if we are taking the actual Merriam-Websters definition of feminism then we have primarily complete and total equality in both the United States and other western countries.
Yes, I do believe we still need feminism but mostly in third world country’s.
I am from Korea and so many people from Korea, Japan and other Asian countries still need Feminism to be arised. God please help us
I think that if feminism has any ground left to go, it should be looking outwards to countries where women really don’t have any rights. Women in the West are doing pretty ok as far as I’m concerned – and I’m a woman.
I think that there are still certain biases that put women at a disadvantage. Obviously there are exceptions to the rule, but many women want to be seen as ‘nice’ in the workplace rather than ‘going against the grain’; many women don’t believe in themselves as much as men do; women feel more socially obliged to do things they don’t necessarily want to do whereas men can just say ‘no’ with more ease; women often need someone to reassure them that they’re doing the right thing or making the right choice whereas many men don’t seem to have this need; and women, at least in my experience, are simply not willing to sacrifice as much as men are for success – they don’t want to give up on their social lives, hobbies or happiness just to become more successful at work – and many successful men are workaholics) or there are the obvious biological differences, such as women having to deal with hormonal changes that affect their behaviour pretty much every month.
Also, the feminist agenda these days doesn’t seem to be that concerned with gender equality. It’s more to do with power. Maybe that’s why we always hear of stats relating to the ‘Fortune 500’ companies and how very few CEOs are women (a position that has power) while we never hear of a woman campaigning for gender equality in being a ‘binman’ or a delivery truck driver (jobs that have very little power but are dominated by men).
I do think that many women need to become more confident – but this isn’t necessarily men’s fault. It’s probably more to do with the way girls are raised in families as opposed to how boys are raised.
And actually, historically men have always been ‘cannon fodder’ when wars break out while women can stay at home and raise children. So it’s not really fair to say that men even historically had privileges when their lives were so disposable.
I think feminism is needed in the west but not to advocate for equal rights legally. (although there are still some annoying things like Pink Tax). Feminism should change from advocating for equal rights to promoting an image of women being strong and dominant(on the same level as men), and not being assigned to gender roles or limited to traditionally female things. Feminism should change to a mindset of empowering women mentally and culturally.
I don’t think that we need feminism it’s just women wanting more privilege. Women already have all the rights as men do, they are just angry because of society´s standards. Like if a woman gets catcalled or accidentally or saved. It is considered ¨Rape” or sexual ¨harassment.¨
only in the certain countries that still lack womens’ rights, so not western or most European countries basically. I mean, I very much struggle to see any sexism against females and if ever claim there is any, from most of what I’ve seen it was just females with the feminist mindset drilled into their brains so they’re not taking a moment to think about what they’re actually being offended about. That’s the problem with feminism these days. Sure it meant something back in the 30s in the suffragettes era and up till perhaps the 70s or 80s, but now it’s just meaningless.
Something that really annoys me is when injustice between gendrrs is automatically cosidered injustice for females. At school in England, girls play far more hockey than the boys in PE. Boys have to play a lot of rugby. I’d rather play hockey because I hate agressive, cintact sports. Quite a few girls will often say it’s unfair on them that because they’re girls they can’t play a male’s sport. Erm… excuse me? Same for the boys who want to play hockey like me? Why is it always the girls that are considered victims of sexism even though it’s clearly the same story for the boys?
That isn’t exactly that bad I guess, but my point is, people aren’t actually thinking, their just following the popular opinion, and because of that, I would argue that males are now suffering from more sexism than females; feminism is pointless.
Most women are real feminists nowadays and so very awful to meet. Real men haters is what the great majority of these very pathetic loser women are today, and MGTOW is getting a lot stronger and safer today more than ever. GO MGTOW MEN, which you will be saved.
You sound like Trump. Narcicisstic, entitled and utterly self-absorbed, trying to hold on to undeserved privileges derived from your gender.
Feminism doesn’t need to be a thing in then US. In other places yes, because they don’t have equal rights. Women will say we get discriminated well a man can get a lifes prison just from a girl that said “i got raped by so and so.” Even if they do prove that its false it can still ruins someones care with serious allegations like that
No. Not this kind of feminism. We have more than enough Leftist in our lives
No, we don’t. Feminism is cancer and a hate ideology. This movement no longer defends equal rights but power and lies. Those around the movement are viscious liars and violent people that only spread hate speech.
I think is people whose are thinking that we need feminis is the people who need it. I don’t need feminism, I already treat women in equality.
We don,t need feminism… we need education and comon sense
This girl is completely mad!!
Short answer: yes.
But I also give full support to men who feel left out. That’s how incels and violence is born you know, not acknowledging each piece of the puzzle..
It has become gratuitous in the west, still necessary maybe in other places
If we have to be honest communism is the only ideology that gave women equal rights.
Chris, not the only, according to the European history Justinian codex gave most of the rights to women. Which endured till the 19th century. However, communism gave the maximum of rights to women in one of the most barbaric and atrocious eras of West, industrial – colonisation era in which the west was throwing children into the mines and people into the zoos.
Chris, The Communism was honest ideology, but ,THE PEOPLE ON POWER wasn’t honest , they twisted the democracy, twisted the ideology, every “communist” leader became a dictator (not for BG)
But the system had many advantages as well, free health care, free education, more discipline, more respect to the oldest ,more kindergartens and of course equality between man&women.
Don’t blame the system, blame ppl on power who created the system ,becouse they are greedy, MORE MONEY, MORE POWER
Anelia, I can already see many “smart” people using your arguments to justify fascism and nazism. A bad system is a bad system.
Chris, that’s true….it impoverishes everyone equally.
Do we still have rapes, biases in jobs, money, careers?
What feminism
More than ever. But needs to look east rather than losing its orientation in the west.
We do need feminism because having equal rights is only the first step. We also need equal opportunities. If you take a look at the gender pay gap, you might (or might not) be surprised to discover that a country such as Germany has a gap of around 21%. Even the best-ranked countries (Luxemburg and Italy) have a gap of 5,5%. And the average gender earnings gap in the EU amounts to 39%. You can also take a look at the representation of women in national parliaments – there might be a few surprises there as well. I could go on, but the point is, in Europe there is still structural change needed in order to achieve gender equality. There are great projects which try to tackle traditional conceptions of gender roles (what are women and men supposed to be and do according to societal beliefs). You can find out more about such projects from the website of the European Economic and Social Committee.
Vessi, what you wrote is a big fat lie. The wage gap for so many tumes has been prove a lie but people keep spreading it.
What I quote are official EU statistics. You can go check them out.
Vessi, Equality is not like a buffet where you can load your plate with what you like and skip the dishes you dont.
Feminists call for equal representation in leadership positions, political offices, high paying jobs etc. How about equality in dangerous and hazardous professions (eg. Miners), how about you also serve in the military like men do?
Lefteris, in the EU world of today no one forces you to be a miner, in a lot of countries you don’t have to serve in the military either (e.g. Bulgaria, Germany, Belgium, Italy, Croatia and others). There are of course still other countries such as Greece which have military duty still. But let’s not forget there are different models and you can also find men and women bound by military duty in Norway and Sweden. And then there are lots of countries where you can choose between military and civil duty. I think also in this respect equality should be provided but I’m also a proponent of a professional military and the abolition of military duty for all (men/or men and women). And also women should be raised with the mindset that they can be whoever they want – not only what traditional societal norms postulate. You are welcome to disagree with me, however you see I’m not trying to be polemic here. Let’s be civil, right :)
Same job, same working hours = same pay… Women usually work less extra hours and prefer to not work on holidays due to family, so they get paid less. This is the difference.
Hugo, you should ask yourself why women in some countries prefer that. Please compare West and East Germany which now are one country and spot the difference. What I can tell you is that in post-socialist countries most women do work full-time (but we still have income differences).
HJo, it doesn’t have to be radical though. :) There are different streams of feminism. And clearly the focus should always be on both men and women enjoying the same rights and opportunities. And when everyone in society agrees about all those points you mentioned and people are raised to be proponents of equality, then there would be no need for all feminist streams.
Vessi, do cultures and people who embrace equality deserve to get extinct with time? Of course the answer (the words) is always no, but the actions seem not to match the words.
PS. Pay gap is a scam. The more you peel the layers of the claim, and the more details you find that have nothing to do with gender prejudice,details which the claimers don’t want to show, but when revealed by others they try to dodge and avoid. And employers ain’t idiots, otherwise they’d hire only women, if that pay gap claim were true. We need equality of opportunity for sure, but the devil is in the details, which you shall keep an eye on.
Sorry am in German and our payment system is based on qualification and experience. Not on Gender. How you negotiate your Contract payment that’s your own business. Don’t push it on Gender. We are all equal and we have equal opportunities in the system . What you make out of it it’s your own responsibility.
If there differences in job payments depending on the region like east and west then these differences affect all genders. So I think most of your arguments ain’t right
And if you want to push this on only two Genders remember their individuals who want to be both Genders. What should they say then? We should consider qualifications and experience other than Gender.
“toxic masculinity” dressed in pink… smh 🤨
Vessi, while I agree that opportunity, pay etc. should be equal between all genders I’m not sure if feminism surfs this purpose because its a radical position. Just an additional comment, Gender gap statistics are difficult to read as it’s a complicated topic. Talking about e. G. Germany, you would need to pay woman more money then man to close that gap and that again might serve feminism but not the principal of equality.
Well, tell me data about university registration by genre and by wage of the proffesion studied. For example: how many girls are registered in ingenieries, aeronautics, etc and how many girls are registered in lenguages, laws, etc. Compare it to boys registered in the same college carrer. It should change your oppinion.