For the first time in over a century, both Labour and the Conservatives failed to win a national election in the UK. Instead, the UK Independence Party (UKIP) topped the polls and will be sending 24 MEPs to Brussels, almost double the number of seats it won in 2009. Labour and the Tories only managed 18 MEPs each, while the Liberal Democrats – junior coalition partners with the Conservatives – were practically wiped out, receiving only one seat.
The reaction from our commenters has been mixed. However, one very happy comment was sent in from Kevin, a UKIP voter from the UK who was pleased to see UKIP emerge as the “clear winners“. Still, he didn’t like the make-up of the new European parliament, adding that “despite all the anti-EU feelings, we still have a very pro-EU parliament, and that’s disappointing“.
It’s true that, despite stunning results for Eurosceptics in some countries – particularly France and the UK – two-thirds of voters nevertheless backed pro-European parties. In many countries – including the Netherlands, Italy and Finland – the vote was a letdown for anti-EU parties, who had expected to make larger gains. The Economist calculates that only 14% of MEPs in the new European Parliament will represent “parties that explicitly advocate leaving the EU or euro”.
We recently spoke to Stuart Agnew, a British MEP from the UK Independence Party (UKIP), about the election results. Did he share Kevin’s opinion that, despite the result in the UK and France, the overall picture was not quite the political earthquake predicted?
I would have said it’s a step in the right direction. Whilst we’ve had an earthquake in the UK, it’s been brewing and bubbling for fifteen years, whereas the reaction in Europe against the EU started later and therefore they’ll always be behind us. So, they are now where we were ten or fifteen years ago. We could see it before they could, let’s put it like that.
So, Kevin may be frustrated, but I think it’s got the rest of Europe moving and I think we can see an end to EU government in Europe within my lifetime. And I think Britain will be out within 10 years, I really do believe it.
Next we had a comment from Catherine, who was suspicious about recent YouGov surveys showing the rise in support for UKIP comes at a time of shrinking public support for a British exit from the EU. According to the latest polls, 42% would vote to stay in the EU versus only 37% who would vote to leave. And if David Cameron delivers on his promised renegotiation, the results would be even more dramatic – with Britons overwhelmingly supporting EU membership by 54% to 25%.
The results seem to correspond with other polling suggesting that UKIP voters are motivated by other issues than just EU membership. Still, Catherine found these results strange. How would Agnew explain them?
Our next comment came from Ironworker, who pointed out that the latest figures from the Office for National Statistics show that after 1 January 2014, when work restriction were lifted, the numbers of migrants from Romania and Bulgaria actually dropped. There is some controversy over the data, but Ironworker nevertheless criticises UKIP for its strong rhetoric in the run-up to the elections. How would Stuart Agnew respond?
But, if I was a Romanian or a Bulgarian, now is the time I would want to come to Britain, because one could sleep rough in the summer months and then meet the qualification period of three months [for Jobseeker’s Allowance]. We don’t know how many are here. We just don’t know, and this is the problem. We really have no idea. We can’t screen anyone for carrying infectious diseases, and we can’t screen anyone for a previous criminal record. We have to find out about these things the hard way. And we think it’s simply an impractical and unsustainable way of carrying on in this country, when you have such a huge disparity of wealth.
If we all had a similar standard of living, free movement would be more plausible. But when the average blue collar salary in those Eastern European countries is about the equivalent to what we call our Jobseeker’s Allowance, you simply can’t lose out by coming to Britain. And I don’t blame them for wanting to come. Many of our forbears went to Australia because they felt they would get a better life there. And so, if I was living in those countries, I would chance my arm in Britain. You can’t really lose, you can only gain.
It’s worth pointing out that Crisis, a UK charity helping homeless people, argues that the overwhelming majority of migrants from Eastern Europe (including Romania and Bulgaria) do successfully find employment and accommodation in Britain.
Our final comment was sent in by Daniel. He said that he knows what UKIP are against: “They are against the EU and too many foreigners. But nobody knows what they are actually for… Whenever Mr. Farage is asked, he keeps talking around the answer”.
Despite its electoral success, UKIP has made few firm commitments to national policies beyond pulling Britain out of the EU. How would Agnew reply to Daniel?
However, on health, welfare and education the British government has much more control, and if we produce policies in these areas too soon they could be stolen. It’s happened before, to the great unhappiness of our party, that we have launched a policy and then found it taken by a larger party. So, Nigel Farage had a press conference a couple of days ago in London and he announced we are launching a raft of policies in September. That is his pledge, that is his promise. I know, personally, that there are a lot of policies simmering away – a lot of work has been done – but we haven’t pushed the ‘Go’ button yet. That’s going to happen in September. So, if Daniel doesn’t mind waiting, he will hear more specifically what we are for in September.
Why does the rise of UKIP coincide with shrinking public support for a British EU exit? Was UKIP wrong to talk about the “floodgates” opening to Romanian and Bulgarians? And what do UKIP actually stand for, in terms of national policies? Let us know your thoughts and comments in the form below, and we’ll take them to policy-makers and experts for their reactions.
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They are 2 different issues, ukip are an outlet for a protest against government not the issue of EU exit
Do you even know what UKIP means?
It means United Kingdom Independence Party, how can you then come and write that they are not for a UK Exit from the EU?!?
You have obviously never listened to Nigel Farage’s statements.
The EU is our Government. Past and present parties are JUST SUBSERVIENT ADMINISTRATIONS TO THE EU.
I wish they simply LEAVE! Nobody stops them, I am pissed off to listen their propaganda all day long everywhere.
@Ana Georgieva
…and we are a tad annoyed at paying money trying to civilize and industrialise countries like yours!
me too!
You seem extremely bitter about having a democratic right to govern ourselves, why is that? Why do you think Britain is here to please a bunch of backward basket case nations? You apparently care a lot that we’re leaving. Is that because you know we fund half of third world Europe. It is you who’ll go to hell not us.
And we Swiss are not even a EU Member yet it is expected of us that we should pay money to your poor Eastern Countries to modernise them, look as far as we Swiss are concerned the EU can have as many members as it wants, but FINANCE THEM YOURSELF! Dont expect Switzerland to pay for your illogical & gigantomanian urge to expand, expand, expand no matter what.
NO! UKIP only got 27% of the vote. The silent majority in the UK accept EU membership (even if they are not ‘happy’ with it) and a large vocal minority hate the EU, because they wish the modern world would just go-away. The election results showed this, with Labour and Conservatives (both two-faced and confused on this issue) getting half of the votes and the Lib Dems, the only real pro-European party getting 6% of the vote.
@Mark Calvert-Foster
Don’t forget that some Brits dislike the EU because it is UNDEMOCRATIC, CORRUPT and too that the UK gives far, far more to the EU than it receives.
Furthermore, pooling democracy with countries that have long histories of corruption, fascism, flawed legal systems, contemptuous police and worse is NOT IMHO prudent!
Never trust any government sponsored or EU-acolyte sponsored polls.
Example: 2005, last poll before referendum in Netherlands said 63-37 in favor. Result was 62-38 against. France had similar but less dramatic swing.
The antidemocratic forces (=pro-EU) and their media friends will put phony poll after poll out to make it look like people see it their way, when in reality the polls themselves are designed to browbeat people into submission.
Besides, UK would be better off out of the Eurosoviet Union. UK doesn’t need fortress Europe when it can trade with the entire world without needing Brussels OK on that.
Its the pro-EU (=anti-democracy) side that wants a fortress Europe against the big bad outside world. It won’t happen because we won’t let you. Death to the Eurosoviet Union!
@Marcel
I know what you mean about EU-acolyte organisations, many part-funded by the EU itself. Said organisations seem to regularly present INCORRECT facts as bona-fide eg:
http://one-europe.info/in-brief/how-many-foreigners-are-there-really-in-your-country
wherein the UK apparently has a mere 7.6% of its population identified as foreigners when the true figure [according to the ONS] is 12%+.
@Tarquin Farquhar
“the UK gives far, far more to the EU than it receives”
What is actually keeping the UK in the EU then? Seems like a suicidal tendency to me. Do you really want to bleed your economy dead? Or do you perhaps omit something in your calculations? Like, the profits resulting from access to the open common market? Heck, even the dreaded immigration helps to keep enterprise costs down, boosting your GDP.
Grzegorz Staniak — what keeps us in the EU is the fact we’ve pooled all our eggs into the EU basket through privatization. Now, they hold job fear over us in the form of “if we leave, 40,000 jobs go with us. Do you want to be responsible for ruining our economy; for making people redundant; for increasing the rise of benefits and homelessness?” I, of course, say “40,000 jobs” because I don’t know the exact figure.
Also, the immigrants is what drove our economy down in the first place. But when you mention that fact, you’re a racist (I’m second-generation English).
And nobody EVER mentions how poorer countries were forced to implement austerity measures so that Germany didn’t suffer from adverse inflation. Which irritates me.
And the ironic thing is, two World Wars and Germany took over Europe without a single Jackboot in sight.
@Self-determination
Well, if you believe that cheaper labour drove your economy down, I suppose you’ll believe anything. So yes, go on living in a world where a financial speculation bubble that cost trillions of pounds just magically doesn’t count, but supply of cheaper workforce simply brings the counry to its knees. It’s actually amazing how ideology trumps reason any time for some people.
I suppose its just coincidence that adverse inflation occurred following the open door policy?
@Self-determination
Do go on and explain to anyone who’s had an even introductory course of macroeconomics how exactly cheaper labour increases inflation. Just let me grab some popcorn first.
How true the UK particulary England lives in the past and
Thinks it’s superior to rest if Europe
Not at all, don’t listen to the right-wing propaganda machine. Out of the total % of the electorate here 65% didn’t vote, 9% voted UKIP, 8% Labour, 8% Tory, 3% Green, 2% Lib Dem etc. (European Elections).
There is no popular support for UKIP, it’s just the majority of people don’t care :(
@Liam Gibbons
Don’t listen to the BIASED Europhile propaganda after all a MASSIVE 57% of ALL Europeans didn’t have enough faith in the EU to bother to vote at all!
PS: The biggest EU party only accrued c16% of all possible votes in the EU.
PPS: Don’t forget, due to digressive proportionality the EU gets disproportionately extra Europhile seats eg hyper-pro-EU Luxembourg got 6 seats when it should only have 1 vote!
Er .. Let me get this straight, you’re actually saying that the party that won more votes than any other doesn’t have support based on the turn out? I don’t think you know how voting works sunshine, it doesn’t matter if only 1% turn out to vote it’s still whoever gets the most votes wins like it or not.
I didn’t vote. It was a silent protest. I know several others who also did not vote, due to silent protest.
I however support UKIP, and think the guy talks a lot of sense. He says what others think, and is unashamed of it. I’ve heard people pull the racism card, but really, everyone’s so quick to put an “ism” to anything these days — especially as a way of winning a debate when you do not agree with what a person a saying but are too stupid to debate the issue properly. “You must be racist to have an adverse opinion of immigration”, “it’s racist to want closed borders”, etc.
@ Self-determination – you didn’t vote? Then you should shut up. People that do not vote have no right to join a discussion or to complain later.
why dont you put a paneuropean vote?
pro or againsta EUzone
Because it’s not up to Europe. It’s up to Britain
what an audience we would not win another war with people like that and who ever follows Cameron with have to have a phd in lying
Poor english guys. No problem anyway: we can keep Scotland. *_*
@Liam Gibbons
Don’t listen to the BIASED Europhile propaganda after all a MASSIVE 57% of ALL Europeans didn’t have enough faith in the EU to bother to vote at all!
PS: The biggest EU party only accrued c16% of all possible votes in the EU.
PPS: Don’t forget, due to digressive proportionality the EU gets disproportionately extra Europhile seats eg hyper-pro-EU Luxembourg got 6 seats when it should only have 1 vote!
UKIP wiped out the party of in…..lets put it to the vote.
The party of in is also the government, protest against the government, Lib Dems lose
I wish them all best in the world. They are useless anyway. The resources for further development of Europe are located in the East. Ask Germany if you don’t believe me. We can handle it without Britain. Bye, bye and stay afloat !
@Ironworker
Germany’s attempt at lebensraum expansion for resources into Ukraine failed, yet again!
The EU has too few people and too few resources for it to be a global power.
Without the UK, the EU will become a dead man walking.
At the end of the day the EU needs the UK more than the UK needs the EU, unless the EU lets the UK pick its cherries the EU will FAIL!
BTW, the UK will stay afloat – we have the commonwealth or Anglosphere options.
Gotta love Tarquin’s desperate “I am leaving don’t try to stop..but no seriously i am leaving !!!” rants around this forum.
Dude if you want to leave, more power to you.
You go your way and the EU will go its own way, just stop complaining about it, we support your cause lol. We also want to get rid of you.
We all agree.
You want out, we want you out. Problem solved.
happy sinking.
@Crayven
The idea of an EU is a good thing but NOT if it includes UN-REMEDIATED, vain, basket-case/corrupt countries like… where do you come from again?
If the EU does not reform to the UK’s liking and the UK leaves the EU then:
your country will lose >15% of whatever net EU contributions your country receives as part of the EU SOLI’C’HARITY incentive
+
your country will have to fork out billions in order to attend to your OWN national defence instead of leaving it to other wealthier EU nations like the UK
ULTIMATELY, it will take your country much longer to civilize/industrialise itself if indeed it ever can – look at Greece, its gone back to being a developing nation despite billions upon billions upon billions of EU monies.
Just remember this before you let your passion run away with you – if poor, bankrupt, backward and corrupt countries with very little in the way of a world footprint can join the EU in a matter of a few years think how quick wealthy, law-abiding countries all speaking the same language and having similar legal systems with many times more land and sea resources than the very, very, very small EU can form an initial trading union? Two years methinks?
Please don’t bother me with your irrational/passionate stereotypical selfish and needy view of the world, its quite distasteful.
I am sure your country has a lot to offer BUT until it can wean itself off charity from its paymasters – chin up!
We seemed to have managed perfectly well for the last 1000 years without you lot dragging us down thank you, good luck when your failed currency finally goes through the floor, such a shame you’ll. o longer be able to come to Britain with your begging bowl, where you going to go for all your free money, housing ,education , money? Greece? Ha ha ha ha
lol …. straw clutching at its most desperate.
THE QUESTION IS SIMPLE – Do we want to govern our own country or not?
A return to democracy would be very nice – I think the rest of the sovereign nations in Europe will see it the same way, if they were given the clear information.
Psychiatrist – Harley Street
@Robin
But is it a return to democracy, or return to nationalism? Do we remember where nationalism took us in the past? Are the “new populist” parties democratic, or just playing the same, old, “blame & hate the others” card again? They seem to be feeding on popular resentments rising in bad times — a defense mechanism, don’t you think? Are you sure that’s a good basis for democratic development? Because quite a few times in our history it rather gave very different results.
EVERY TREATY SIGNED FIRST BY THE CONSERVATIVES FOLLOWED BY NEW LABOUR WERE AND STILL ARE DETRIMENTAL TO OUR COUNTRY. IMMIGRATION HAS BECOME A NIGHTMARE FOR THE BRITISH PEOPLE BECAUSE IN 2004 ALL THE THREE PARTIES PLUS THE GREEN PARTY SIGNED BRITAIN UP TO OPEN BORDERS WITHOUT ANY STRUCTURE OR CONSULTATION WITH THE PEOPLE OF THIS COUNTRY INCLUDING THOSE BEFORE 2004 WHO WORKED HARD AND DID NOT GET BENEFITS.
Hi Frances, do you have any evidence for this? Because the research that I have seen by City UK is showing that EU membership is beneficial to the UK economy but it is also showing a gap between what public opinion believes and the reality on the ground. Anything further I could read that proves your claim?
Who in their right minds would have ever believed that the Germans and French would have given up their currencies for the Euro.
Decades ago, the British Tories could count on roughly half the seats in Northern Ireland and Scotland and roughly a third in northern England and Wales. Today they have been virtually driven out of each of these non English regions and been replaced with nationalist or unionist parties there. This latest election, the UKIP scored big in northern England, where they have displaced the Tories as the biggest competitor to Labor for working class conservatives who are more interested in seeing fewer brown people on the streets than in cuts to social services and not taxing London’s financial securities. Assuming this is not a blip of protest voting to Cameron, the Tories will have a difficult time winning an absolute majority in any election.
In short, between protest voting and longterm decline of the Tories, the UKIP’s vote has more to do with British politics than EU principles. Sadly most voters in the EU parliament elections cast votes over national concerns than pan european ones.
the people of europe vote EU must be change. for the people of europe not for the markets and banks
Nop! That will never happen! Besides UK is busy with the EU-US Free Trade Agreement so… Lots of blah blah but the Key players know whats up! Cheers!
I think people want to see our broken political system fixed. This doesn’t just mean reform of the EU, it means reform of our broken electoral system, as well as more transparency. You can hardly accuse the EU of lacking democracy when our own system fails so spectacularly. I think this is what the UKIP vote is mostly about.
I don’t really care if the UK leaves. Maybe they will partner with the US, since the UK is always more aligned with their interests that the interests of the EU.
You got it.Best thing to happen would be the british leaving the EU.Probably we can keep Scotland
And why don’t we question the 60 % abstention figure
If you look carefully at the results in every country the main issue was, unfortunately, national policies over European policies. Europe was hardly discussed. People are concerned about the economic situation, jobs, immigration and security and feel it is Brussels fault. Nationalism is a dangerous path that tends to surge whenever there is an economic crisis
Honestly I don’t blame brits. It’s understandable why they gather around Nigel Garage. I don’t like it either to wake up in the morning with Gypsies laying down on my porch or on my fresh mowed lawn. But I think they just over reacting. However, the whole keepers euro campaign in Daily Mail and such open the Pandora’s Box. I would pay a bit more attention at RO and BG reaction after years of public denigration and humiliation. I bet that it’s not over yet. I would like to see mass deportations of romanians and bulgarians out of Britain. The beginning of a new era.
You got it.We had more then 1.2 million migrants in the last year which is second highest in the world.The overall population is 80million…The question I asked myself:”Do you want your kids and grandchildren to life in Germany or in a country where noone actually knows what german culture is actually about and have to go to a museum to find out what a “Schwarzwälder Kuchen” is?”
Well that is actually what we all are heading to…
“I would like to see mass deportations of romanians and bulgarians out of Britain.”
Well aren’t you a welcoming chap.
@Crayven
Taking my words out of contest doesn’t not put you in the position of making recommendation by default. It was just cruel sarcasm.
GB is an island, anyway, they drive on the left side of the street. If they want to go out , let them support to do it . Sooner or later Scotland and Ireland will want an independence . Most probably they will renegotiate to stay in Europe .
@Rudi Spoljarec
We in the UK drive on the LHS because in olden times it allowed drivers to use their right arm for sword-fighting!
Rudi. FOUR members of the EU drive on the left (UK, Eire, Cyprus and Malta) as do about a third of the cars in the world (Japan, Pakistan, India, Australia, Thailand, South Africa….), so I don’t see what that’s got to do with it. Scotland is having an independence referendum in September, and I don’t know where you’ve been for the past eighty years, because most of Ireland is an independent state. The UK needs to stay in the EU, Great Britain NOT little England!
The answer is simple: the #uk will never join the #EU due to the fact that it can not. The country is self supporting and has been for hundreds of years. Against all of the current member sates they have a secret service that is one of the top institutes in the world if you truly believe that they will allow the #europeanunion access to the #MI5 and #MI6 records you are mistaken. Even #france does not step up to this standard and as a quarter of the population seems to be #communist I very much doubt that the English would wish to participate. Europe is just England’s holiday camp and always has been. The offer of the treaties when set out from the 50’s has never been agreeable to the English. For those of us that have lived and still live in a European country it is classed as a very long HOLIDAY. We attempt to educate the Europeans in all aspects of our culture. From Language (of which the EU speaks 51 percent) to manners and education, the English lead the way. Historically the Brits are the ones that have stood up on the front lines of countless wars given their lives in the name of the sovereignty and freedom. The rest just followed. Before any country in Europe tries to lead and I am referring to #Junker a lesson in Politics would help, maybe Europe needs to get better educated before it proceeds. I will be attending the #g7brussels meeting next week follow live: https://twitter.com/beakmull https://plus.google.com/u/0/+BeakMull/posts
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ahh, litle britania cries foul.#
i hope you leave the EU as so
on as possible, so that the rest of europe can go ahead.
And yes, we europeans speak english. But that does`t mean, we value anything of british or american cult ure.
And yes, you may be proud of yor secret service, but it will nothelp you out of your economic crisis.
Yeah, guess what? Europe is also tired of you, Englishmen. Nobody that is minimally politically interested still have patience for the UK’s everytime complains, always posing an enemy to a more complete and functional integration.
You wanna know what the UK was and is from the end of the war on? It’s not Europe that has been the holiday camp for England, but rather Europe was the pivotal focus of Washington and London was an only an intermediary.
I understand all the drama around UK’s economy and how people usually perceive this as such in good state. However, that’s not true and your best statesmen know that, even though that your Europhobia/or rather the one promoted by your media don’t permitt, Europe is the better plateau for projecting power, at the moment.
You are getting out of resources. The brittish pound and The City will become increasingly left aside, with the emergence of East Asia as the new global pole and regional reserve currencies ascending to global reserve statuses.
On regarding the language question, of course the English would inexorably be an important language, with the lenght of the Empire helping. Yet, you fail to achieve that the responsible for driving English global was the USA and not the UK, otherwise it would be of second importance, e.g. like the French or the Portuguese.
Plus, yes, I admitt you faced uncommon diplomatic freedom of choice during the aftermath of the WWII. Nonetheless, that is explained by the fact that the UK was the 2nd biggest economy, being that the 3rd was less than half of the UK’s GDP value at the time, which explains the centrality of the English economy in the European construction project and, therefore, the patience endured by the other members when dealing with you.
The big exclamation point enters now, when stating that, even though at the time you were the largest economy, you were the most stagnant one in growth terms since the post WWII, not comparing one slight to the German flexibility or the French dirigisme, and not even attaining similar highlight spots such as Italy or Sweden did. No, the UK was mostly stagnant, given the fall of the Empire and the resulted lack of resources. And I don’t prospect good trends either with the possible sort out of Scotland, which accounts a lot for the national wealth.
Concluding, you’re no longer a vital piece for the European project. Bye bye, please.
The arrogance of this comment is mindbending.
And the only reason i am speaking to you in YOUR language is because you are probably too dumb to LEARN OTHER languages.
Most of us continentals know 2-3 languages besides our own.
Mark, if you are British, I like your opinion, because in that case it’s original , but who knows what other citizens want.? I didn’t mean to say that driving on the left has to do something with it , I meant it as a simbol of different thinking that other Europe does, now and during the history.
Hi! I’m Italian! I can’t answer to this question…..but i’m displease for this. I think that we losing the dream built in 1950 for United State of Europe. I think also this is the signal to change the Europe. Now we need to Politic Union. Because Putin created the UEA, well Europe isn’t able to face this new market if the States are separate.
Why face it?Only cause the yanks hate the Russians?Instead of challenge it we could just go and join it,showing the americans the finger^^
@Alex: the Eurasian Union is a fascist dictatorship union. I rather NOT join it.
Farage is working his way to defeating all those in our government who betrayed the electorate the last time out, when they lied to get votes and the minute they took office, reneged on their promises. So, he has a really good chance of moving the earth into a politically landslide, should the other parties not dramatically change their political policies on immigration and the slavish following of political correctness, felt by a large percentage of Brits to be the result of our connection to Europe.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/may/31/ukip-contest-seats-senior-tories-2015-general-election
labour 3 broken promises on votes , tories 1 , limp dems….campaign for a vote…first to scupper it. UKIP in every election from now on.
Rudi, Yes, I am English, British and European, I also feel a strong connection to my region – Sussex. I don’t see any conflict. GB has a culture that is slightly different from other European states, but that’s good. Europe should be united by it’s diversity.
That’s what they hate, the EU is about killing diversity and making everywhere the same.
Marcus, I would be really curious to hear where you get that from. I have lived in several European countries over the years and I am truly amazed by the anti-EU comments I’ve been hearing in the UK. Like yours, they always consists of loud statements presenting the EU as a threat but never come with any specific evidence to show how the speaker has come to this conclusion. Please, I would really like to hear back from you.
@Luke Lamb You are correct! But maybe you are a bit naive to sugest that things remain static! Hint: Globalization!
Hint: Scale Economics
Hint: Geopolitics
Hint: Energy!
Think about that before you allow Nationalism to overtake Rationalism.
Cheers mate!
Now our newspapers are claiming the demon Blair is once again being considered by Germany as good to head up Europe. Can this be real? I cannot believe they would be this crazy.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2645052/President-Blairs-plan-save-EU-He-tells-Germanys-Merkel-defend-Europe-far-right-fuelling-speculation-bid-Presidency.html#comments
Now this consideration has to be the surest way to get the Brits to despise all Europe and its surrounding supporters. However, the US must find him a post he can grin in, just to ensure he keeps his mouth shut over Iraq. A European Commission President waiting to be tried in the Hague for possible war crimes is one way to ruin Europe’s image in the world forever. But, that could suit them down to the ground.
Considering this man set the Middle East on fire and is now the peace envoy; how sick is that. just shows us how naïve and corrupt politics is today.
Thank you for highlighting my thoughts and Stuart for your considered reply.
. I believe the change in poll results is due to the change in the question asked . It is no longer a IN/Out question but includes strings like would you stay in with less integration or with repatriated powers ect .
If the boot were put on the other foot , “would you vote for increased political integration ” (which is the agenda) Im sure the response would be overwhelmingly OUT.
Does UKIP’s election victory put Britain on course to leave the EU?
I don’t know if kippers ( 17% ! at locals ) are up to the magnitude of such an event. It depends on voters majority will of course, but not before 2017. Keepers are hoping and rushing things up: romanians do this, romanians do that, we can take it any longer, we want out, bla, bla… Their whole rhetoric is made to generate national discontent and a certain animosity (assuming that hostile media and political opponents to Garage Nigel doesn’t went fishing crabs and oysters). They are swimming in muddy waters, making a lot of noise and grab everything they can. Kippers are trying to achieve easy political victories fast, hopefully for them before 2017 year of Our Lord when the referendum was proposed. My personal opinion is that Garage doesn’t have a solid political and implicit ideological base. In long run, one or two election cycles, it’s very unlikely to maintain the same tempo, and they know it. Romanians are just not an endless mexican Piñata.
@Ironworker:
If Farage wins an election, unlikely but possible if he plays his cards right, there will be no need for an in out election in 2017, hence his appeal. Where he has a possibility to win is, if he turns his right wing economic stance into a more socialist all enveloping promise, then you will see a bigger landslide than Marine Le Pen. And he knows it, so if he wants to rule the UK, this is what he will do.
The promised election for in out in 2017 for the UK is a bribe to get the electorate to vote Tory. None of the other parties promise a referendum on it of any kind if elected except the Tory’s. If Farage wins a majority of seats to carry a mandate, a referendum is already cast as fact.
TB is on the UP, they make our city look bad , Less English born youth are gaining jobs. The Rich are getting Richer, the Eastern European Mafia is in the UK , Eastern Europeans are bullying English staff at work .. out of Europe now .. 0 respect for Brits ..
i hope so …….
Absolute clown, in pink. The whole world laughs at them. :)))
Let’s all raise a glass and toast the unmitigated success story that is the EU ….Pfffff ha ha ha! Sorry couldn’t keep a straight face there.
Nothing. Populism never meant much else than awfully manipulative media coverage. It means Murdoch & News Corp are in some parts of the EU.
It tells us enough is enough! The UK must rethink it commitment to both the UK and the EU. It is best done outside the EU.
Clown or not he doesn’t love eastern europeans …
People don’t seem to realize the amount of hate there is in the UK itself for this guy.
http://www.biogeocreations.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/GeorgeOrwells19841.jpg
Not a lot
why so much hate for UKIP guys? :)
Ukip= populism
Yes of course UKIP are popular , they would not get very far if they were unpopular would they ? ALL governments should be populists , its what gets them elected
UKIP= The will of the people,
what you call populism ,I call Democracy ( something lacking in Brussels )
The word Populist is used as a derogatory by people who are in denial about the true nature of the EU ,which is control without accountability .
Brace yourselves….romanians are coming in UK to work and to rebuild their beautiful country
Where do you get that from, last week my partner and I almost had money robbed from us, we had to call the police before we could get it back. The same week my daughter and son in law, who had left their front door open while my grand children where out playing had an unwelcome visitor who saw this as an opportunity to just walk into their home unannounced. We live 3 miles apart from each other. We are the same family and it happened in the same week by people who came from the same country. So just what kind of work and rebuilding are you actually talking about here, because I actually liked our old way of being able to walk down the street without being mugged and being able to leave our front doors open without the fear of strangers entering. Please don’t continue trying to work and rebuild our country because its making our country a much uglier place to live in.
Next time people please vote so we get less idiots like this representing use.
There is no hate, he is funny. :D
I believe it will depend on next years European policies. If you look closely, populism didn’t win only in the UK, but a little bit all across the EU. If those were simple protest votes or if they really mean anything, I do not know.
But European leaders and the European Parliament have to wake up and realize if the path that is being followed is the right one. I truly believe in the EU project, but we can’t have such discrepancies between countries all across Europe.
A disaster the mans a complete prat.
Bratu Marius-Cosmin, I would agree and he is a bastard, comes all sweet and offends you in your face! So British! So arrogant and rude! But, in Croatia he was ridiculed and laugh at! I think he got the message! :)
who cares… your rude in UK to the people born in the country / we a victims of a open door policy .
More than you think Mr Ansonia.
Mr. Bean in power, lol! http://images.search.conduit.com/ImagePreview/?q=nigel%20farage&ctid=CT1750559&searchsource=3&start=0&pos=0
Well, according statistics, 64% of British haven’t voted… take it into account.
https://twitter.com/AFP/status/470712532291047424/photo/1
Thanks, we will take into account that 64% of the population could have voted ukip too! the only indicator is how the other 36% voted.
Result – a ukip landslide, hopefully at the general election all those ukip voters will come out of the woodwork.
It will be very hard for the UK to leave the EU. The EU is the largest economical market on the globe, and many companies and investors might move out of the UK to the mainland should this vision come true. Sometimes it is better to influence from within, than as a spectator on the sideline? All EU countries are asked to jointly build the Union, it is our organization, as opposed to ‘theirs’.
“sometimes it is better to influence from within, than as a spectator on the sideline?”
A typical pro-EU soundbite, unfortunately as has been proven many a time if a country doesn’t agree with something the EU will just find a way of working around them – e.g. FTT
“All EU countries are asked to jointly build the Union, it is our organization, as opposed to ‘theirs”
Unfortunately it is being built from the top down instead of the ground up by an elitist bunch of bureaucrats who couldn’t really give a toss about the average European on the street
I don’t think any big company would move to the continent, the continent is a huge basket case. An inward looking self centered group of neo-quislings who care nothing for the rest of the world.
Trade exists without the EU, just ask the WTO. Britain stands to lose nothing. Especially not if it can offer better deals to companies without being shackled to Eurosoviet regulations.
We Netherlands would be better off out too.
Well considering that they sell more to us than we sell to them; that will be their loss….there is no reason at all for them to control the British, trade with us and that is all, Oh here we go again, yes you’re damned right here we go, 76 years ago the world changed and that change for the good was led, not by Germany or France, or Belgium or anyone else; only Britain; how soon these spivs in Brussels forget, Get down on your hands and knees every night and pray to God that Britain stood alone to fight an evil because without us; the British none of you would be here today; here endeth the lesson and By God how is must hurt the Europeans who are not Telling us; the British what to do; I THINK NOT.
The first “party” in Uk elections was the onthouding. This means that 36% of UK citizens have voted. 2/3 haven’t expressed a judgment about EU. If EU will help unemployed, employed in general people I’m sure they will remain in the Union (as many other countries). Now it is time to change! To show to euro-sceptics what Europe is and what it can do
They are still outsiders in the EP so really not much impact
I just love it when people trot out the old “populism” allegation without actually considering what it means
Populism means “popular with the people” and to be honest every party should be populist because politicians are elected to serve the people in their best interests not dictate to them
…..and the opposite of populist is elitist which I think just about sums up the EU…..
so given a choice, in my opinion populism wins every time
World laugh of who? European Union without Great Britain is,a Joke
Yes indeed, here we go again, now then who invented these, Radar, hovercraft, MRI machines, Computer, Calculator, Internet, Merlin Engine, Lancaster, Spitfire, Mosquito, Solved the Enigma machine codes, Television, Industrial Revolution, Railways….Longitude….and lots more….please wait….I am thinking… why it was….. “The British”
Nigel is a Gypsy, that’s why he says they are Romanians …
I hope they will actually! And I hope they will realize how many benefits they receive from the European Union!
Actually Stefano it’s the other way round,the last time I looked the UK was propping up the euro zone ,it’s not a secret that the UK is in the top 3 contributors to the EU budget.You can find this sort of information out quite easily if you can work a computer ! Be very clear,if the UK leaves the EU your entire EU finances goes down the pan ,I don’t see many of your buddies in the EU lining up to make the kind of contributions we make.
What was it you were saying about the benefits we recieve from the EU,I have really been trying to think of one……..and failing.
UK or England? I believe Scotland is to remain in the EU after the referendum….
I hope they go out of EU, so that we do not have to listen to their propaganda all day long, BBC is poisoning the whole World with their bulshit. They can make a separate union with their best friends Turkey and USA, so that we have at last some peace in our minds and souls, and in our economy as well.
lol…the bbc is very pro eu…..the eu is ruining europe and the sooner we are out and i can rid myself of the worthless eu citizenship foist on me without any choice the better.
Yes, stay in your isolated island, where you belong.
Yet all you europhiles seem so bitter and nasty because we don’t want to be a part of your failed little club, why is that? Is it because you won’t be able to get your thieving hands on any more of our lovely money? Or that you won’t be able you leave your third world crap hole and come and leech off our welfare system anymore!
Our isolate island as you say, stood alone in 1939 against an evil the world had never before seen and led the way to your saviour, the very fact you exist, breathe air was originally due to us; the British, Commonwealth, USA, Anzacs….so before you scoff at this little island who made the world you live in from the industrial revolution to the internet; see my previous post on what Britain invented…..please give us a little more respect and thanks us for your life.
You can fish more, and live only on fish. :D
£10 billion buys a lot of fish……
@Ana Georgieva
We would sell you the fish but you are too poor to buy our fish.
Never mind, as the biggest charity giving nation in the EU and the 2nd biggest in the world, I am sure that if the UK leaves the EU we can provide charity directly to your country and furnish you with new-fangled technologies like abacuses, doors, bicycles, candles and loo-roll.
C’mon – you gotta agree that last paragraph was funny! :)
oh…so funny my sides are splitting….that was as pathetic as eurovision.
Eurovision; says it all, a joke each and every year and By God have we been sent to Coventry by them as they ignore the British entries; so what, we made the world you lot live in, see my previous posts. We British invented most of what you Europeans have and do…….upset you all, great so it should. WE ARE BRITISH and no one else on Earth has such a stable society and economy, Magna Carta, Waterloo, The Nile, Trafalgar, Winston Churchill, and lots more.
Your brain is splitting for sure, if you have brain at all.
La vittoria elettorale di #UKIP significa che il Regno Unito (se continuer ad essere unito) si staccher, prima o poi, dall’ UE e prender… il largo… verso gli USA!
Not at all
Economist Nouriel Roubini had a terrific editorial on the parallels today with the 1930s, in how economic failure and widening inequality led to extremist fringes rising to the mainstream.
@Jovan Ivosevic
Hmmm, that might be true in nations such as France, Germany or Holland but NOT the UK – just another example of how the EU is a collection of disparate states with different cultures, aptitudes and dispositions.
BTW, at least 2 of the aforementioned countries have a tendency toward extremism.
In 1972 Britain had two choices. Expand the commonwealth trade pacts in conjunction with the US or go Europe.Realistically what are their options now.
Though the EU in its infancy was all about trade . (and what we signed up for) that is no longer the case . The trade issue is secondary to our sovereignty . We should have stuck with our global trading partners of the commonwealth but that ship has sailed , we now move on . This could be an option
http://www.williamdartmouth.com/docs/Out_Of_The_EU_and_into_the_world.pdf
Realistically we remove ourselves from EU
For the love of GOD just LEAVE and spare us your “civilizing”, Britain.
Europe has had enough of this whining UK. Enough!
Just kick them out already even before they get their stinking “referendum”.
Nothing is done because these curs won’t stop sabotaging every change!!
The second we get our democratic right we’ll be gone. Gan one away from the scrounging, democracy hating vile scumbags who tried to steel our right to self govern under the despicable lies of a ‘free trade agreement’ the EU can rot in hell along with the pan-continental destruction of europes economy, culture and identity. ‘Stinking referendum’ ha ha thank you for confirming the EUs phobia and contempt for democracy. We’ll just stand back and laugh as you’re pathetic little empire crumbles and disappears up it own backside and crumbles like it’s starting to right now.good riddance,don’t come to the uk with your dirty begging bowls.
Yes indeed we British invented just abou everything you use and have and we British fought two world wars so that you could breathe air and we British have a long lasting Monarchy unlike no other and we British saved your bacon in 1939 and led the way to a more stable world; Europe did not, Europe caused the deaths of millions of people’s within 21 years of each other; led by one nation that, without the UN would have risen again, That is the fact about us British; we always win a war and we never retreat but stand out ground as we are doing against a corrupt regime Brussels, Stasbourg; The EU, upset you has it, great, We are British and no one tells us how or what to do, in times gone by it would have been WAR.
Why did my comment telling brits to leave the EU has been censored?
Let them go freely wherever they please, clearly progressive policies are not in their interest. They want to be corporate slaves like ‘Murika.
I’m sure you can get France to cover for the loss of Britains net contribution.
@Crayven
If the UK left the EU that would be fine by me BUT I’d much rather prefer a fundamental democratization of the EU ie EU 2.0 if the EU is prepared to raise its standards.
Indeed, if the latter option was exercised I would even be prepared for my country to FURTHER help civilize/industrialise your country by assisting your country in acquiring new-fangled products like wheels, doors, toilets, pens, soap, fire, paper-clips and above all A SENSE OF HUMOUR! ;)
‘Let them’ and here is the issue, we neither seek nor want their permission to do anything ever. It’s our decision, not something we need to consult with the great unelected dictators thank you.
Nothing, people without historical awareness come and go . Great ideas are here to survive.
Did you know in 1939, France had the largest land army in Europe and surrendered; says it all; doesn’t it. Britain however, unprepared, finally declared war on Germany, stood alone in the world; a little rock just off the coast of Europe who did not get in boats and scarper to the USA, it stood alone, stood it ground and with a generation that will never be seen again. fought for who we were, what we were and led the way to Freedom. so all prayers from Europeans are welcomed.
clowns
This newspaper story is the reason the British people are wanting to leave Europe. They believe that by being part of the legal system Europe set up on immigration rights, they are being flooded with undesirables that they cannot bet rid of. And this is not a one off, it is a daily occurrence here in our media. Murders, dismemberment, horrendous rape, theft, and on and on. It is a relentless line of invasion we cannot afford and don’t want to accept..
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2646634/Mum-killed-baby-deported-human-right-family-life.html
No country in their right mind would want to surrender to such perversity, if the story is true. And if it isn’t true, and European law is not creating this havoc, why don’t they tell the British people directly to clarify the situation?
Look it’s simple, trade with the EU as we voted for only, welcome a controlled influx of immigrants who are educated, professionals, qualified skilled; no criminals or spongers and that is it. No one tells the British how or what to do; for Brussels, think FIFA; says it all for me. We are British says it all.
A quick word on the meaning of populism.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/populism
Populism is the boat that floats democracy. Without populism the EU would never have go off the ground in the first place. The boat would have sunk when it left the shore.
Any politician or party that derides the meaning and word populism is wanting to rid the citizens of that state their right to select who and what they will follow and agree to. In other words they fear the peoples vote. And they especially fear the peoples vote when what they are trying to sell is unworkable and and against the popular interest and they know it, which is why they try to deride it. They have no argument good enough to change the thinking of the majority.
Popular is what all political parties have to be, otherwise, in a democracy they lose. Beware of any party who fears being popular.
Bring forward Direct Democracy the only democracy that is genuine and popular.
@Catherine Benning
Despite your recent RACIST and HOMOPHOBIC rantings [and of course your spelling errors] I agree with your post – 100%!
You’re equating the words ‘popular’ and ‘populist’, and that’s simply an error. A political party (or a leader) can be popular without being populist, and vice versa, irrespective of how often this actually happens. The adjective ‘populist’ describes a certain attitude and method of gaining popularity, not popularity itself. History actually knows examples of unpopular populists.
Here are some more adjectives, smug,arrogant,bell-end.
Eagerly awaiting a pompous, condescending lecture in a hilariously patronising, long winded and self important fashion.
Btw please feel free to cut and paste from any wiki page.
Thanks darling
I agree with Catherine Benning , she isn’t a racist or HOMOPHOBIC, anyone with the name Tarquin Farquhar or Grzegorz Staniak was probably not born in this country and is implementing their own culture into our society ( not needed or wanted ), and probably in the UK to take and make another Brit un-employed .. I am a victim of a open door policy. UKIP for me..
@Grzegorz Staniak
FYI, try to be logical and dispassionate when attempting to make calculations:
FTR:
A mere c80% of UK trade is intra-EU,
Less than c10% of UK trade is with the EU,
Of that c10% about 3 of the 10 percentage points can be discounted because of the Rotterdam Effect,
Of that c10% about 1 of the 10 percentage points can be discounted as the UK will trade with Ireland with/without an EU
That means that c6% [AND DECLINING] of UK trade is with the EU.
Even if the UK left the EU then both parties would STILL trade [FAIRLY] courtesy of the WTO.
Given the UK’s economy is expected to grow by >c3% this year and that the GDP of the Commonwealth passed that of the EU a couple of years ago and that the UK would gain > £30B by not paying to be in the EU/German-hegemony ‘club’ and the UK would gain c£3B by regaining its fishing grounds and the UK is rapidly increasing its trade with non-EU states (the UK economy is the strongest of all G7 countries this year), I think the UK’s leaving of the EU would cause a minor kerfuffle – nothing seismic.
Checkout the following for elucidation:
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danielhannan/100171677/no-prime-minister-the-eu-is-becoming-less-economically-important-by-the-hour/
Ignorant financial analysis will not fool the people for long.
http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/01/20/uk-britain-eu-trade-idUKBREA0J00B20140120
They can’t all be wrong.
http://www.economywatch.com/world_economy/united-kingdom/export-import.html
Basic Economics.
http://www.wto.org/english/res_e/statis_e/its2013_e/its2013_e.pdf
@Catherine Benning
Ignorant and partisan financial analysis will only fool fools like… :)
Checkout the following, they are ALL totally correct:
http://www.williamdartmouth.com/docs/Out_Of_The_EU_and_into_the_world.pdf
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27284489
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/10807824/EU-benefits-to-British-trade-are-imaginary.html
http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/405985/Proof-Britain-doesn-t-need-EU-our-trade-with-rest-of-the-world-is-now-booming
BTW, the UK should get out of the EU not merely because of the millions of foreigners from the continent that cost >£8k/year/person in terms of just education+health services support BUT because it is CORRUPT and UNDEMOCRATIC. What’s the point of being wealthy if you can’t exercise your democratic whim?!
http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/466737/REVEALED-The-55-failures-that-show-the-UK-has-little-influence-on-the-EU
Furthermore, pooling democracy with countries renowned for extremist parties [and worse] like France or Germany or with countries that fail to feature in the TI Top 20 index is NOT my idea of a union that is beneficial to the UK.
The EU should be about raising the weak/poor/corrupt countries to the superior levels of the Northern EU net contributors and NOT to the LCM.
Now look here, we care not one jot about percentages, what we are saying, Trade with Europe, but no Control; simples, what else is there to it, A simple sentence; Trade but no Control.
Being part of EU must be an honour… if the people of UK doesn’t feel that being part of EU and build a united Europe is an honour and a privilege, instead of trying all the time to use EU just to pursuit simple national interests, UK must leave EU right now and this will be good for the rest of Europe
I agree and we can wait …
So it’s an honour, how naïve a statement; should read, be honoured as a European and thankful and pray to us; that the British stood alone in 1939 and led the way to save your bacon; for without us; none of you would be here today. THAT IS A FACT OF HISTORY.
Britain the Europe the Europe the Britain
I; as an Englishman and a Briton have no desire to be known or controlled by foreigners; Trade with them and that is all, how simple can that be. As for this FIFA organisation; this corrupt organisation The EU, I did not elect them; that is un democratic, I did not vote to let them rule us; the British; that is undemocratic. Hope this makes it perfectly clear. Trade with them, no Contorl by them. Have a nice day.
While reading these endless comments from Tarquin Farquhar and fellows, who seems to be representing this “vocal minority”, I suddenly start to believe internet censorship would be a good idea…
But seriously, what of the problems in your life are caused by the EU? Reading your comments it sounds like all of them.
I really would like to know, because for me EU has given so much more than it has taken (just to mention a few: opportunities to travel, work and study abroad, cultural richness, friends etc.).
Educated, qualified people were traveling abroad for work and cultural enrichment long before the EU came into existence…all the EU has done is make it possible for the low life’s in society to do the same
..and the major problem is financial, we pay more in then we get out and that is my taxes that are going down the Euro-drain
@Joona Juntunen:
And when they censor what you don’t like to read, they will, when it suits them, censor you and what you want to say and think. Freedom of speech is what saves us all from being subjugated by those who have our demise in their agenda.
And if you believe they already are not censoring what people think and write, you are naive. They do it all the time. For political expediency under the premise of, its in our best interests to do so. Censorship is simply an extension of indoctrination. Followed, of course, by the fear of freedom.
This is why the only democracy is, Direct Democracy, the way the Swiss have it.
@Paul X: holy crap, “the low lifes” ?
So anyone who couldn’t afford expensive visas or had the time to go through countless check-ups is a “low life”.
Jesus christ where do you and Tarquin get this rhetoric? SocialDarwinism.com?
The more i listen to your ( and Marcel and Tarquin’s ) garbage the more i think there should be some form of censorship against nuts.
Of course freedom of speech is important, as long as it doesn’t go to hate speech. However in order to have a balanced debate I think there should be more voices heard than the same people passionately repeating their agenda with rather strong use of language.
@JUNTA Juntunen
CENSORSHIP is for dictators!
FYI:
The EU encourages CENSORSHIP. (Example your post.)
The EU is NOT DEMOCRATIC. (Eg Degressive proportionality.)
For some countries in the EU its a gravy-train for others its a royal-pain. (Eg the extra c£3b the UK uniquely loses/year because of the CFP or the net contributions the UK makes to previously poor EU countries that are now richer than large parts of the UK.)
Please, try NOT to be so SELFISH and consider being BROAD-MINDED for once.
Sometimes the vocal minority may have a valid point or two or three or …
I would be greatly in favor of censoring all pro-EU views, after all pro-EU is synonymous with anti-democracy.
How do you like this kind of censorship, mr Juntunen?
@crayven
By jove I think you’ve got it !
Yes, no visa entry. If they can’t afford a visa then they clearly don’t have the means to support themselves and no country needs that type of immigrant
None of us in Britain know or have been told what we get in return for giving EACH DAY £55,000,000 to Brussels; So what do we get, no one at all seems to know or wants to tell us; so is it any wonder why we British want to leave the EU; Trade with them and no Control by them. Is that CLEAR?
Out of your union.
@Crayven
One minute you despise objectivity, the next minute you want to censor people who happen to have well-founded and articulate concerns about the EU. Please don’t taint us in the UK with your congenital dictatorial nay fascist logorrhea.
Your comments are symptomatic of someone who comes from a country sullied by extreme/fascistic communism, lies, corruption, unfairness and outright irrationality.
What blighted, benighted, bumfuzzling, bemusing, beguiling, barbaric country do you come from again?
Even Catherine ‘I’ve made RACIST and HOMOPHOBIC comments’ Benning is concerned by your censorial zeal and she is not by any stretch pro-UKIP.
You are a classic example of someone who bites the hand that feeds them. No wonder even I, a person of African and Irish heritage wants to vote for UKIP!
Let me repeat my question to you Tarquin: Why exactly do you hate EU? What problems in your life are caused by the EU?
Yet another bad choice for the UK, picking a border line racist and homophobic party to represent you. As for leaving the EU that would be silly closing off a market of about 400 Million people just because of pride ?
@David Eaton
Your juvenile reference to PRIDE rather than other significant FACTORS such as DEMOCRACY, TRIAL-BY-JURY, THE ABOLITION OF THE DEATH PENALTY, BORDER CONTROL to name but a few marks you down as a bit of a lightweight old chap.
@David Eaton:
First of all, why would the UK be cutting off a market? Leaving the EU on a political level does not interfere with the buying and selling of goods. Otherwise that would mean we would have no trade anywhere in the world unless we planned to live under their political system. What nonsense. And the EU sell as much to us as they buy here.
Now, please explain to me what you mean by borderline racist and homophobic party? Do we not trade with outright racist and homophobic countries in the world, like say Israel, outright racist, and some African States, definitely not for homosexuality and they have the death penalty for it, some Middle Eastern countries, Saudi Arabia for one.
What are you being fed in your political education. Sounds very skewed to me.
If you mean UKIP a borderline and racist party; what rubbish, they say what most British think and are afraid to say I believe. Why would a nation like Britain who made the world the rest of you live in want to be told what to do by foreigners; We made the world you live in and we invented most of what you have an use today; Controllled by other NOT AT ALL. For EU, think FIFA.
@Junta Juntunen
I’ve already provided you with an answer, it may have been queued by DE whilst you posted.
BTW, I regard your eagerness to censor as ANTI-DEMOCRATIC and ultimately a FASCISTIC WEAPON. It was the continental European/Germanic tendency to CENSOR speech that ultimately lead to WW2.
Also, please take care NOT to misrepresent me – I am in favour of a re-modelled, DEMOCRATIC EU an EU 2.0 if you will, but NOT an EU as-is.
UNTIL, the EU is made more DEMOCRATIC and the UK is allowed to pick all of its cherries then I will be against the current incarnation of the EU.
I think it is a great argument for Scottish citizens to leave the UK
Yes Yes the english have always refused to play a full role in Europe I am sick of
Tory and UKIP 19th century politics
I agree that the Scots could take this opportunity, but besides that, I am not sure that not all British are eager to leave Europe and live in a money laundering island, ruled by the City of Westminster.
@Pedro Pais De Vasconcelos
There are plenty of money-laundering countries in the EU too, eg France (BNP Paribas).
The question still remains whether ALL British, meaning the English, the Welch, the Irish (north) and the Scots, and all the others second generation immigrants, are willing to leave Europe.
But I am sure that, in Europe, common people will not be governed UKIP like far right policies.
It would be far better for the English to read less tabloids.
@Pedro Pais De Vasconcelos
You seem awfully eager to CENSOR information.
What country do you hail from again?
Europe is a continent, a land mass. British want to leave the EU. The EU is not Europe. I’ll demonstrate this in a simple example:
The EU (undemocratic Eurosoviet Union) is bad for Europe, as it and its Euro cause more poverty, more unemployment, less jobs, less middle class in order to satisfy the rich criminal banker cabal of which it is a tool.
My dear Tarquin Farquhar
First I do not hail, I write.
Second I hate censorship and it is a mystery to me why it came to your mind.
But there is one think that I would like to make very clear: there is no Democracy without a good quality press, and the tabloids are definitely not the best of Fleet Street.
And last but not least, my country is EUROPE.
All the best, my friend Tarquin.
Europe isn’t a country.
Saying ‘Europe is my country’ is like saying ‘Santa Claus is my homeboy’ or ‘The Easter Bunny is my best mate’. It’s total nonsense.
I for one would like my country, Netherlands, out of this money-draining Eurosoviet Union, this antidemocratic monstrosity, as soon as possible. We’d be better off not having to subsidize Portugal and the likes of them.
Continental media is nothing but a bunch of propaganda tools who publish Eurosoviet press releases without questioning.
Not necessarily. Hopefully, now that people get to hear more from him, it will become more obvious how he does not know what he is talking about and that his party’s goals are not good for the majority of people. I think it is a bad idea for any country to come out of the EU, although some change is necessary. There is the need for more and more substantial integration.
As a Swiss I say to the British think long and hard about who you are and where & how you see your future and then you will kno wwhat to do.
E.g we Swiss have no desire to join the EU and we are living just fine without EU membership. I have no doubt whatsoever that Brittain would not only survive just fine without EU membership but that you would thrive, and it would also help to strengthen the position of countries like Switzerland when negotiation time comes up with the EU.
S.K. Thank God for someone with common sense, you are absolutely right, well said, have a nice day.
I agree to some extent that UKIP is a protest vote, But I also think that is greatly reduced theory as the years have past, the percentage of voters who have joined UKIP who like their policies have increased vastly.
You have to remember that while UKIP has done well in European elections because of current voter distaste for government and EU policies, UKIP is also growing in other areas as the UK population also is fed up with government policies in all areas, Defence, immigration, health etc.
I have personally seen and heard something I never thought I would hear again, friends and family talking about a trading block with the commonwealth, now whether you agree or not people are talking, and whilst I have to admit I don’t know a great deal about the commonwealth apart from it is a collection of former colonies that formed a free and equal association, the idea of forming a bloc with the likes of India, austrailia, Canada, malasia etc is more attractive to me than Germany, france etc.
This is also a UKIP idea, they seem to know what the majority of UK want at the moment.
How true the UK particulary England lives in the past and
Thinks it’s superior to rest if Europe
With the recent Tory defections to UKIP, we appear to have a new constitutional convention in the United Kingdom whereby defecting MPs first resign to fight a by-election. Is this a good thing? And, seeing as the UK does not hold by-elections for MEPs, could this make future defections from one British party to another in the European Parliament impossible? Could it even be one of the reasons a certain Conservative MEP hasn’t also jumped ship?
Anyone who thinks we should stay in the EU should read “The Great European Rip-Off” by Craig and Elliott, and then see if they are still so keen. I am on the left politically and for that reason am against the EU because 1. it is undemocratic 2. it is damaging to third world economies.
First may I thank you for a good hours entertainment reading all the messages . Let’s get out of this eu gang as an child I seen my town diversify just out side London (slough) with all races was ok to start with then more and more came with no respect for our way of life and didn’t want to interact with us realy please go a see it now for your selves that is not my town no more not welcome there now im the wrong colour and race (British white) So we moved to Wales near the sea and I became a fisherman were I watched week after week month after month eu boats land fish caught from the uk coast landed into eu lorry’s and driven straight back to the conternant with no regard for our local fleet who are restricted by there rules .We had a very diverse fishery because of our geological position but I’m afraid it’s too late for this generation the fish have gone and so have many of there boats . My generation have never had a say on eu membership only a dictator ship and i think ukip although not perfect will give us the best chance to have a choice but look who’s voting now every tom dick and Harry who are afraid of what won’t but might happen if we do pull out .I still work on the sea pulling in ships with this trade you all talk about witch ant gonna stop any time soon in or out of Europe .The British Isles has a place in history and always will do we will as we always have done make our future
Most of the legislation in Britain is eu legislation adopted by past and present governments without the British people having any say or referendum…it’s done and dusted before we find out….why? If the eu is so great why are nations particularly the British ignored,the decisions they are making affect our daily lives and extremely negatively. My impression of the eu is a corrupt political regime grabbing more power while make us irrelevant. Poverty and crime are escalating and nothing being done.I believe this is the regimes plan of overall control,I can see no other logical reason for the continued negative legislation.
The agencies have just gone in and dragged out of bed FIFA crooks, so when are they going to head for Brussels; we are waiting.
I was never asked if I wanted to be ruled by the EU. Our country was signed over to Brussels by a couple of elite MP’s without the peoples consent.
Absolutely right; sold down the river to the Europeans and lied to; a generation of politicians who think they represent the people; we do not have proportional representation; one man, one vote; 51 percent wins, for had we, then instead of the SNP in the House, it would have been UKIP. The Establishmen were rocked by UKIP; how dare these upstarts join the club, well they have and they will get more powerful and should the Tories tell us lies; the I can imagine the Tories will be sent out into the wilderness; like the Labour and Libdems for 40 days and nights to contemplate where they went wrong. For me, it was wonderful to see Labour and Libdems massacred, wiped out, obliterated; it could not have happened to nicer people; most of whom were arrogant and totally misread what we the people were thinking and wanted. Be warned a Revolution is happening and it will; I believe gain momentum as more and more people join the people’s party UKIP. A Britain ruled by the British for the British; what could possibly be wrong with that?
I have read many comments here and this for me is a simple issue. I voted only for a Common Market and nothing else; certainly not to let anyone outside of Britain run my nation. If anyone disagrees then they are totally out of touch with reality. what normal common sense person in Britain; a British subject wants to be controlled by foreigners; an unelected government; Brussels and overruled by the European court; many of whom are not even judges. If anyone British subject thinks this is acceptable; then there really is no hope for us at all and the result will be more legislation, more control and overriding of our laws and customs and much more. In fact we will become slaves; Not I, for I will not be told what to do or how to do it by any foreigners, in times gone by it would have bee war.
I voted for a ever closer Europe, not fot th ressiscitation of EFTA
People on the left and the right should read “The Great European Rip-Off” (David Craig). And this article:
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jan/17/leftwing-eurosceptics-eu-british-left
Britain is supposed to be a member state; in the European Union, all in it together…but how come our neighbour and friend; when it suits them; allows thousands of illegal immigrants to queue up at Calais enroute to Britain. If the French were our friends end EU close neigbours, then they would have rounded all these undesirables; and I haste to add for those namby pampy leftist liberal nutcases; that is not a Racist terms; it is commonsense; then the French should have sent them back to the last country from whenst they came; that is if the French were our friends and close EU neighbours, it seems they are not, so again, why should we remain in the EU, the system cannot work, it will not work, it is dying; the EU and it is costing us British one hell of a lot or our hard earnt Taxes that we need at home, hope this is clear to all those who now who will be running up the Jolly Roger and heading to sink us; the British, we never lose a battle; remember that.
UKIP’s victory does indeed mean we are on course to leave the EU; we hope, it certainly means that the Tories were forced pre election to offer the voters an IN/OUT Referendum, had it not been for UKIP and Nigel Farage, then the Tories would not have done this.
Nigel Farage is the only leader in Britain who says how it is; answers with a YES or a NO or a DON’T KNOW. no other politician has done that; they wheel and deal and lie to us; the voters and this time it has come back to bite them; like it or not, in Britain we are seeing a Revolution of the workers; the people, those who once were the Mill Workers trodden on by the landed gentry, the rich and powerful; well folks, this is the 21st Century and people power has prevailed in the form of UKIP.
UKIP are not yet ready to run the nation, it takes time, but they are a tempering organisation that has sent shudders down the corridors of power as the people say enough is enough and vote for a change.
Whe did UKIP get nearly 4,000,000 that’s millions votes in the general election and only one MP member of Parliament, because we in Britain do not have a fair democratic election system; first past the post and not proportional representation. otherwise UKIP would have beat the SNP to the post; an unsavoury lot of border tribesmen and women whom we thought we had contained centuries ago, just joking of course, nice people really.
So we have UKIP, the people’s party and why did they lose many other voters and no other MP’s could it be that due to scaremongering; that Labour could take the lead, the nation came to its senses and voted for the Tories, the only organised party we have at the present; remember they were left with no money in the bank; that letter from Labour that Mr Cameron produced; well done him, that wiped Labour out for me; a dangerous organisation; LABOUR, who have destroyed much of what Britain once was and wanted to be and again no one is accountable; when many of them should have been tried and sent to jail for gross mismanagement of the state;
Please, read about Mr Nigel Farage, the descendant of German immigrants who is also married to a German that he employs as his PA, but…preaches anti-immigration. Just in case anyone was in any doubt as to the hypocrisy of politicians.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2726735/REVEALED-Penniless-German-immigrant-great-great-grandfather-Nigel-Farage-He-famously-no-nonsense-stance-migrants-Ukip-chief-no-idea-ancestor.html
Oh my goodness seems like the gutter press are trying everything to discredit farage. Great, great grandfather came from Germany. My great great grand parents came from Ireland, Wales, England and holland, that doesn’t make me any less English or British Oh and my ancesters the same as farages came over at a time when there was no benefits and no NHS and much less immigration. Our ancestors had to speak English, work hard and integrate with English society to fit in. Farages wife is German yet everyone calls him racist. I think farages ancestry and marital status rules that out now and proves that farage is just very patriotic to Britain and not racist at all.
Is that how they call hypocrisy in Ireland…gutter press? It is basic common sense that when you go under a French surname, you don’t go on about immigration and expect people to give you their vote over it? And couldn’t a member of the public do the job that Farage pays his wife for?
Britain has been the recipient of many refugees and immigrants in the past. With the same logic that you apply to Nigel Farage the Poles, Caribbean people are going to be English one day. So why is it ok for him to do that but not for other people. The one thing I get from your reply is that Nigel Farage is not the only hypocrite out there and others like him are going to vote for him. The bigger hypocrite and liar he turns out to be the more they are going to vote for him because that’s how they live their lives as well…Each to its own.
preaches anti-immigration. No he does not, neither do I, what we are saying is…We welcome all professional and Qualified Skilled immigrants, but no one else and certainly not people trafficers drug pushers, criminals, terrorist or any one else who will dilute our society. We have Standards, we have the most stable society on the planet and we made the world you live in from the industrial revolution to the Internet; All British Made.
Jim Young. I agree with that, if indeed it is what he says. Although, I find the last bit competing with North Korea. But if you read the article, you will see that under those circumstances, Farage’s own ancestors would not have been allowed in the UK. And this is what is meant by the word hypocrisy…
In any case, the article is there for anyone to read and draw their own conclusions. It made me laugh a lot but didn’t come as a surprise. You have to be a liar to be any politician at all and that is that.
Ancestry, you will find that just about everyone in Britain todahy did not originate from Britain, from the Normans, Vikings, Romans, Saxons, and most of the British Commonwealth, we are all immigrants in one form or another. Rasicm, this term is and has been used by those who want to remain in the EU. I am not Racist but certainly do not want less civilised and uneducated peoples from anywhere saturating Britain, if they follow the correct entry procedures; that’s if we have any now and are permitted by Brussels to vet immigrants, then there is no problem; providing they have a job to go to, want to work, pay taxes and above all, observe OUR LAWS and respect our MONARCHY. That is common sense, there are so many nations in the world ruled by crooks, despots and dictators and one just has to look at their peoples; kept as they were centuries ago, while those in control live a high life and generally they have no decent laws, no respect for each other; machetes, guns, weapons appear to be the normal order of the day for any disputes. We do not want that in Britain. Remember this fact, it is immigrants mainly post WW2 who came to Britain and built the Britain today with their sweat and tears and we thank them all for making Britain the most stable and merciful nation on Earth.
Jim Young, do you mind repeating here for me what this truth is that Farage speaks because it doesn’t make sense to me what you are saying. I would really like to understand. Thanks.
Hello Yvetta, thanks for the valued reply, what I mean is this whenever we see or hear a British politician being asked a question by an interviewer; they always evade that question either by diverting that question or changing the subject; I cannot remember how many times I have watched these spivs and shouted out at the television; “Answer the bloody question”. The only politician who does answer questions with a YES, NO or I DON’T KNOW is NIgel Farage. that is a fact; as of the rest of those politicians, they forget it is we; the voters, the electorate who gave them their jobs; their power, large salaries, expenses accountes; remember the Expenses Scandal, just showed how many crooks were in office; caught out fiddling expenses, our money and what did they do, say sorry, a few went to jail, but most of them got away with it, had we done such things, that would not have been the case; one law for them and another for the rest of us. So to return to your original query, Nigel Farage answers the question.
Hi Jim, my original post was about Nigel Farage and how he doesn’t practice what he preaches and not about the EU, but since you have touched on it and just for the record, the average EU citizen has a higher educational level than the average Brit and that is one of the reasons why businesses want the UK to remain in the UK. It gives them access to a better qualified work force and helps them remain competitive. Some of those businesses have already said they will relocate if they find that their remaining in the UK lands them in an off-shore situation. What this means is that a lot of Brits would lose their jobs as well. Apart from the ones that work to house, feed and clothe those EU migrants. As far as I am aware, and as I have learnt through this debating page here, people are supposed to have a job before they move to another EU country, so if this is not happening in the UK, it is a local failure to enforce a regulation and not a failure on behalf of the EU or a problem with its law. Now which one of them politicians do you expect to come out and admit that they are not doing a good job enforcing the law. It is a lot easier to blame someone else, isn’t it?
Firstly I would like to point out that I am not Irish. I said my ancestry was Irish, welsh, English and Dutch, yet you decided to pick on the Irish, why is it that first you pick on Farages foreign ancestry and then jump to conclusions about my nationality. Your not as pure and innocent as you would like to make out are you, besides that why did you even bring the Irish into it. My thoughts are my own are they not, my thoughts do not represent any country.
Secondly your post was suggesting that Farage was being hypocritical because of his German wife and ancestry. Who says that she is not capable and couldnt be the best candidate for the job (unless you where actually there of course). There seems to be a pattern forming with you, you seem to think that I’m Irish because my ancestry is and that Farage is hypocritical because his wife and ancestry are German. You’re not a closet racist by any chance are you. You know the kind of racists that hide behind their true feelings by trying to accuse everyone else of being racist. Thirdly yes there has been immigration in the past at a time when their was no benefits, no NHS and people would integrate into British society and would become true patriots to this country. Fourthly our country is under pressure from unemployment, education, housing and the NHS. Isn’t it a fair assumption to think that you should put Britain into order first before stretching our resources even further. If you had a child that was hungry and had very little to feed it would you give your child’s food to someone else and let your own child go hungry. Well think of Britain as being the parent and us being its children, share with the rest of the world but only when we know that we have enough resources to do it. Don’t let patriots suffer needlessly.
Hi Chezie, I think that my post was very clear that if it is not all right for other people to do one thing then it is not all right for you or your wife to do it either. I think that everyone of average intelligence gets that. I also asked you specific questions but you have not come up with any answers. I don’t think that the UK is now poorer than it has been in the past. Quite the opposite, in modern times all European countries have been better off than before. Your attitude is one that has been identified by various research into immigration: that second generation immigrants are hostile towards other immigrants and consider themselves as “indigenous”, whatever that means in people’s heads. Trying to play the racist card is a common trick that people resort to when they feel they’ve got no other hope but clearly this does not work here, as it is yourself expressing oneself against immigrants (you seem to have a problem with Irish specifically?) and not me. Obviously, there are plenty of people of Mr Farage’s quality to vote for him and his party but clearly, the biggest part of the population is intelligent and sees through his lies and hypocrisy and this is why he can never be in government.
Won’t be engaging into further conversation with people desperate enough to resort to calling me “racist” when they themselves are against foreigners, simply because they are unable to come up with anything else. Ah, how sad…
I agree with you, this is not an issue about where you came from, remember this to those who criticise people like him, Britains Commonweatlh, without them none of us would be here today. they are many people of many colours, religions and beliefs. they are British as much as we are. Farage speaks the truth, says how it is, does not soften the real truth up and this upsets many people, so everyone MAN UP, stand firm and say what you think, the days of the Mill Bosses have gone forever and it is people power throughout the world and that scares the living………out of those in power.
Jim Young, do you mind repeating here for me what this truth is that Farage speaks because it doesn’t make sense to me what you are saying. I would really like to understand. Thanks.
Oh no you dont get away with it that easily. I have no problem with the Irish, why would I. I do however have a problem with people who open their mouths before getting there facts straight first. You had no righ what so ever to make out that the Irish called the press “gutter press” they were my thoughts and words, you should not have brought any nationality into it at all, just as you or the paper had any rights to bring up the fact that Farage had foreign ancestry or that his wife had anything to do it. You also made out that I have half a brain because you didnt make your original status clear in the first place, obviously my 134 iq is no match for your own. Wow your pretty defensive. I’m not racist either but I can see that I rattled your cage With that comment but then you should have not brought race into the equation at all. Also I’m not second generation more like fifth generation. You seem to be under the delusion that everything is hunky dory when it isn’t, tell the unemployed that everything is o.k, yes there will always be unemployed but do we have to make things harder. Your telling me that schools, housing and the NHS are not being effected but that would not make any kind of sense as more people are entering and not enough things are being done to accommodate the extra demand that this puts on us. You are under the impression that the common people are not effected by any of this so which posh area of Britain do you actually live there so the rest of the 4 million voters can move there and live in your ideal little world. Your a bad minded person and bad minded people will always have bad minded thoughts. Discussion ended.
Yada, yada, yada…apart from anti-immigration I am also now anti-free-speech and a proper fascist indeed and I will go on pointlessly for hours trying to deny it and make other people look like it because that’s the best I can do…
Look I said discussion over, yet you seem hell bent on dragging me back into this discussion. I never said that you were anything but a bad minded person anything else I said was a suggestion of what you sound like which then gave you the opportunity to say yes you are or no your not. I defended the Irish because I felt that it was not right of you to say that my point of view was that of anyone else. I thought that was free speech to be able to have your own point of view and be able to speak freely by it. On the other hand your replies to me have been very close to accusations if not accusations of my character. I said discussion over and that’s because I do not wish to be brought down to this gutter level of argument. I never said once that I was against immigration. Just that we need to put our own country into order before opening our doors to every Tom, Dick and Harry. Your post implied that Farage was anti-immigration (which by the way as far as I gather he isn’t) but then your post implies that Farage is hypocritical because his ancestry was foreign, I just pointed out that the press was gutter because in my view Farages ancestry had nothing what so ever to do with it and was just a cheap and nasty way to score points. We are not going to agree, so stop dragging me into this petty little argument o.k.
I would also like to say; “Roger, over and out” goodbye and thank you all on this subject for some very interesting and frank points of view, and no one has been arrested or shot, that is why we are different to most of the others in the world we live in. Have a nice day.
Ok. We agree to disagree. I love Europe.
Much of this debate is polarised between people who identify with the right and are Eurosceptic, and those who identify with the left and are pro-Europe and open borders with Europe.
I am on liberal-left politically, and for the following reasons I want us to leave the EU:
1. The EU’s Common Agricultural Policy is a protectionist organisation which has devastated the lives of Third World farmers.
2. The EU is profoundly undemocratic.
3. The UK has a proud tradition of offering sanctuary to people who need to flee their own country. Our record is not as good as some others, but better than most. Unlimited economic migration can only reduce the numbers granted asylum.
4. Unlimited eonomic migration depresses the wages and conditions of the poorest working people. This is why the business community, on the whole, is so pro-EU. It means an unending supply of cheap labour.
Lets hope so