Brexit means Brexit. It’s all very clear. Until you start drilling down into the details. Did 52% of voters in the 2016 referendum vote to leave the EU Single Market? Did they vote to leave the Customs Union? Did they vote to rejoin EFTA? Did they vote to create a hard border with Ireland? Was it a vote in favour of the Norway option? Or the Canada model? Was it for “no deal” and a return to trading under WTO rules?

At the best of times, interpreting referendum results and translating them into actual policy is a pretty thankless task. Political campaigns are always coalitions of different interest groups, so maintaining a fuzzy definition of the final outcome can help keep the coalition together. However, it also means that some of the people who voted in favour of Brexit are inevitably going to be disappointed with the result, no matter what it is.

What do our readers think? We had a comment sent in from Alex, who thinks the UK needs a second referendum on the terms of the final Brexit deal. He believes this would be the most democratic way to proceed. Is he right?

To get a reaction we spoke to Pavlos Eleftheriadis, a Professor of Public Law and a Fellow of Mansfield College at the University of Oxford who teaches Constitutional Law, European Union law and the philosophy of law. Professor Eleftheriadis is also a barrister in England and Wales and practises in EU and public law. What would he say to Alex?

I totally agree with Alex, for two reasons. One is that the referendum campaign itself had very inaccurate descriptions of what Brexit would be like. They were very optimistic, and I don’t think they were correct. For example, they said that Britain would have 350 million pounds per week returned from the EU that it could spend on the NHS, which was highly inaccurate. That’s the first problem.

The second problem is that precisely because it’s so difficult to describe what the future relationship might be, no campaign could have done it correctly. So, we voted against what we had, but it wasn’t possible to vote “for” anything in the future, because there are (broadly) four different possibilities: no deal, the Switzerland deal, the Canada deal, and the Norway deal. They are all quite different, and of course the public hasn’t voted on any of them. The referendum result told us that most people were dissatisfied with the status quo in 2016. But, of course, politics is about what you want to do, not what you don’t what to do. And we haven’t yet decided what we want to do.

We also had a comment from Rémi, who believes that once the Article 50 process has been triggered, the UK must inevitably leave. Is he right? If Britain wants to change its mind, will it have to reapply for EU membership? Or is it legally possible to unilaterally revoke Article 50 before the two-year time limit is up?

There is disagreement among lawyers on this, but I think the unanimous view is that if all the other Member States of the EU want the UK to stay, they can do it. Article 50 says that the notification has a two-year deadline which can be extended if there is unanimity. Well, if it can be extended by unanimity, it can be stopped by unanimity. I think most lawyers agree with that.

The question is: Can the Article 50 two-year deadline be stopped unilaterally? Can the UK say: Right, I’ve changed my mind, we’re staying. And I think many people, including myself, believe this can indeed be done – it’s lawful. Because Article 50 says you notify your “intention”, but you don’t notify your decision. And that’s perfectly reasonable because you will only be able to make a decision once you know the terms of the future relationship. So, your intention means that you start negotiating – which is what we’ve done. And Article 50 says you must do it in two years, otherwise it could go on for far too long. So, it disciplines the parties. That’s the meaning of the two-year deadline.

So, my view is that if the UK changed its mind, especially if it had another referendum or a parliamentary vote (any constitutional method would be acceptable) then the Article 50 process can be stopped and the UK can stay in the European Union.

Finally, we had a comment from Coralee arguing that another referendum would be a betrayal of democracy. She believes it would be like saying: “Vote again until you give us the right answer”. Is she right?

Well, Parliament always revisits issues. It’s the democratic way of deciding things: We open the issues, we debate them, and we can change our minds. That’s why we vote every four years, because we change our minds. We vote Conservative one year, then four years later we vote Labour, or vice-versa. That’s how democracy works, and I don’t see why it should be different for referenda.

The question today would be very different, because if the second referendum happens then it won’t be about whether we like the status quo or not – which was the 2016 question. It will be the question: Do we like the new Brexit deal that has been negotiated? Do we want that future? Or do we prefer the status quo?

Remember, many people who voted to leave in 2016 thought that Britain could stay in the Single Market so that the car industry, for example, can have these parts moving back and forth without tariffs or red tape. Clearly if many of these people knew the consequences they would have changed their mind.

So, for me, the two questions are very different. That’s why the British government needs to be very careful about this. To be properly democratic, the choice needs to be: The new Brexit deal, or remain. They are now talking about something else: The new deal, or no deal, which would be a disaster for everyone.

Should Britain hold a second referendum on Brexit? Would a second referendum undermine democracy? And is it even possible? Let us know your thoughts and comments in the form below and we’ll take them to policymakers and experts for their reactions!

IMAGE CREDITS: CC / Flickr – sgoldswo


232 comments Post a commentcomment

What do YOU think?

    • Uli Czeranka

      and what if parliament says no?

    • Paul Vincent

      Then we exit without a deal.

    • Ivan Burrows

      Uli Czeranka There will be an election and the traitors will be removed from our government :)

  1. Mario Pisano

    I m just fed up of them they better just go fuck themselves they never felt fucking European with their driving upside down keeping the border and shit.
    Time to say bye bye and fuck the shit off for good

    • Paul X

      We in the UK drive on the correct side of the road…. I assume you are referring to Australian drivers when you refer to upside down?

  2. Hugo Miguel Carriço

    Na minha opinião, que vale o que vale, os ingleses pensaram que através do referendo, a UE ia andar atrás deles como cães. Afinal, a UE fez como num divórcio, “queres, então toma lá”, os ingleses ficaram com o melão.

  3. Ivan Burrows

    You wish lol, we knew exactly why we voted to leave the pointless EU & now the true motives of Brussels is to create an antidemocratic US of E is known even more people want to get out. But you can have Tony Blair if you want, we have no use for the traitor.

    • Malte Rathje

      Hihihi! Master of Fake News! Gullible Brexiters.

    • Adrian

      Yes Ivan, go free.
      We let you free with no deal.
      GO trade with Antarctica or whoever the hell u want, just please, go.

    • Vytautas Vėžys

      What makes you think that you will ever have full information?
      If founders of EU would know that it will turn out into political oppressive federal machine they would burn all those papers instead of signing them.

  4. Ariste Arvanitides

    ΝΟ, Britain should leave the EE and open the door for the rest of us to leave this NAZI, New World Order Dictatorship. We have had enough of sovereignty being stolen and natural resources being negotiated away under threats and bullying. Bring it down, it does not work.

    • Ivan Burrows

      The lies came from the remain traitors, luckily enough people didn’t believe them :) Will you miss us or just our money ?

    • Rob Eastham

      To be fair the remain camp was a bigger pack of lies. Project fear was the easiest campaign route but not honest with our obligations or membership status.

      I was one of the few remain campaigners who honestly campaigned yes and yes to a federal union. However, even I acknowledge that if federal union had been honestly told as the objective of the EU then the no campaign would have had a landslide Out victory! 👎

    • Dave Pannell

      Cameron : leaving the eu could lead to war / Obama Britain back of the queue / clegg no eu army and no eu superstate just some of the lies the pro eu tried to blackmail the uk public with

    • Ivan Burrows

      “What’s been done”? we are leaving a dictatorship so what else needs to be done ?

    • Martti Immonen

      Stop crying then. Check btw how UK acted inside EU? Like it still would be superior nation. Wrong again,so long UK.

    • Karolina

      Ivan, you sound so racist, arrogant and ridiculous that you are not even aware of it. If you want to do the UK a favour and portray it in a good light, just stop posting here.

  5. Victor Abreu

    Independente do resultado os ingleses tiveram o direito de votar – que eu não tenho.

  6. Vytautas Vėžys

    No. Referendum already happened and people spoke.
    If you value democratic people decisions you should not repeat votes till their match your expectations.

  7. Panos Kontogiannis

    What for? They already authorized the government to negotiate the exit deal and the exit article has been invoked . It’s final. The glass is now broken.

  8. Carlos Botelho de Vasconcelos Matias

    Since the next day there was already a considerable percentage of civil society that had changed its mind, because it did not know the full repercussions or what it would entail in its life, I think it would be both correct and imperative.

  9. Terry Tovey

    We have had the referendum and new what we were voting for. It now has to be delivered in its entirety.

  10. Frederico Carvalhao Gil

    De Gaulle refuse la division de l’Europe « artificielle et stérile » qui est « le pire mal de notre époque ». Sa volonté de modifier le statut quo rejoint ici le sens profond qu’il a de l’Histoire. Parce qu’elle est une réalité historique et géographique, l’Europe ne peut se réduire à sa partie occidentale. Le projet gaullien correspond à une grande ambition internationale : au sein d’une Europe réconciliée, à nouveau maîtresse de son destin, la France redevient, face aux Etats-Unis, un acteur central de la vie internationale. Il est aussi un grand projet d’équilibre et de paix. L’Europe de l’Atlantique à l’Oural inclut l’URSS ou du moins la Russie, car c’est à elle que de Gaulle se réfère le plus souvent, convaincu que les idéologies et les régimes passent alors que les Nations demeurent. Elle implique une réconciliation franco-allemande et un règlement du problème allemand pouvant aller jusqu’à la réunification. Les questions russe et allemande sont ici liées : lorsqu’elle ne sera plus ni totalitaire ni expansionniste, l’URSS contribuera à l’équilibre indispensable à la Paix.

  11. Paul X

    No, because promising a second referendum gives the EU the green light to give the UK the worst possible deal knowing full well it will swing the result.

    The UK has already voted for Brexit, therefore the only meaningful second referendum would offer the choice of either accepting whatever deal is given, or going for no deal

    • Adrian

      We already won’t give you a deal.
      Wake up.

  12. Filipe Nunes

    Of course! There should be as many referendums as needed until the answer is the one you want!

    • Andrew Lucas

      The UK was never fully implicated in the EU, since they refused to join the eurozone and the Schengen Area.

    • Ivan Burrows

      Andrew Lucas The other Nations (included France) would have refused to join the idiotic eurozone and the migrant madness of the Schengen Area if they had been asked but asking the ‘people’ is not what the EU does. Paying for it now ain’t you.

    • Ivan Burrows

      No thanks, the EU is all yours and you can keep it, we are rejoining the free world :)

    • Seán Rohan

      An EU without UK is a leg that has been healed

    • Jude De Froissard

      The shengen area has nothing to do with the e.u…it is a separate treaty and countries out of the e.u. can be in schengen.

    • Jude De Froissard

      And countries and out of the eurozone can be part of the e.u. ..dear Andrew Lucas.

    • Magaly Morales

      Ivan Burrows A pity that the free world have little time for UK

  13. Savas Ozyurt

    Time for our own #EUReferendum. European Parliament, European Commission, and Council of the European Union, get it organized. We want a #Referendum on whether the UK should be allowed in, or whether it should be kicked out of the EU.

    • Kirstie Mamoyo Rogers

      No one is ‘kicking us out’ we’re leaving anyway. Do keep up

    • Savas Ozyurt

      Oh, were ya really? It sure doesn’t look like that right now.

    • Daniel Suranyi

      It’s not even about changing their mind. It is about the final deal, that they couldn’t vote on because it wasn’t on the table. The referendum expressed the willingness to leave, but without the conditions. It would only be fair and logical to also ask again once the condition are clear, if that is what the people wanted.

  14. Paolo Gazzola

    lol A referendum on a Referendum? Like asking citizens “are you sure you weren’t really that stupid?”.
    A second Brexit vote would be the asmission that voters aren’t responsible for themselves. As it is.
    I’d support a second referendum only if we accept the idea that not everyone suitable to vote when turning 18, that we must put requirements stricter than citizenship and coming of age, like “telling news from fake news, understanding a political program, understanding consequences and, most of all, the right of voting with a solid view of world and geopolitics.
    A citizen has to know and undestand glocal History, Sociology and Psichology.
    Otherwise, we’re gonna to ask to revote every stupid thing done with the use of fear, hatred and fake news.

    • Daniel Suranyi

      It is not all a referendum on a referendum. It is about the final deal, that they couldn’t vote on because it wasn’t on the table. The referendum expressed the willingness to leave, but without the conditions. It would only be fair and logical to also ask again once the condition are clear, if that is what the people wanted.

    • Paolo Gazzola

      Right, cause voters were too ignorant on referendum day, they did not understand its consequences and they didn’t know where it would have led.
      We let sheeple vote and here’s the result.

    • Paul X

      @Daniel Suranyi
      Every time you vote you never know exactly what you are going to get.

      A general election has all parties exchanging economic spin and half truths and
      once you elect a government you don’t get a chance to vote again once they actually deliver their first budget do you?

  15. Christos Georgiadis

    In my opinion, should the UK change its mind about Brexit (by whatever means it likes) the EU should only allow the UK to remain if the UK waives all claims to the various exemptions it has secured for itself over the years.

    • Kirstie Mamoyo Rogers

      Not a chance. We tried to get the EU to reform and they refused. This was the result.

    • Tiago Pereira

      What reform did UK propose to the EU? lol

    • Magaly Morales

      Tiago Pereira they tried to veto and oppose any social and political integration during all their time of membership.

  16. Mark Sjøberg

    Yes. Why should they ? 3 points here. 1. The civil war in Syria is hopefully coming to an end, which will lessen the stream of refugees considerably. Thereby removing much of the short sighted ammunition of the nationalist right. 2. Much of the information the average voter had on EU was at best faulty or lacking, if not downright false and misleading, In regards to so many things. Voters should be and I think are much more informed now, and so see much more clearly. 3. As both sides(EU & UK) have now seen what we all have to loose by UK leaving, concessions should be achievable for both sides, where issues were rigidly stuck before. All member states have some issues that should be taken seriously to make EU more transparent, and not too centralised and rigid. We need it as an entity in today’s world and in the future. So have a new referendum after these issues have been discussed. Good luck Europe.

  17. catherine benning

    Should Britain have a referendum on the final Brexit deal?

    Why? What has the EU offered the people of the UK that was not there before? They have made it very clear they intend to and will continue to import millions from the developed world for the Europeans, which would include us, to fund from birth to death. For no reason that I can see will be of benefit to us or be considered value for money. In fact the cost of this lunacy is against the best interests of any of Europes citizens.

    The EU has a failing economy, has no idea where it is going politically or strategically, has a problem with its decision to remain a dictatorship and the leaders are despised by the British in general.

    The mad woman leading Scotland will soon be thrown out by her constituents, she is planning and has already suggested giving the Scottish peoples vote to immigrants who reside in Scotland, thereby reducing the power of the Scottish people to decide who they want to lead them, so she is going to be out on her ear. The Conservative is set to get into power at the next GE there. For some reason the Scots like that woman? So, north of the border is contemplating whether staying in Europe will be such a good thing after all.

    Likewise, Northern Ireland. Plus, Southern Ireland is beginning to feel its rightful place is within the UK. The EU having become a betrayer of Westerners and their cultural magnificence. Have you seen what they plan for European school children?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fL5-gz5L8c8

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hIv-KOQ5F4A

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kk-V2uPcSLw

    Is this what the majority of the European people want for the future of their families? I don’t think so. So, the only way to stop it is to remove your country from being part of the EU, for to remain prevents any possible deviation from the madness they love to force on us and hold us there by threats.

  18. Seán Rohan

    No!! England/UK has been a weight holding back the EU for years….the referendum needed is in Scotland so they can be independent and stay as EU citizens….but good riddance to the English

    • Stefan Versac

      So you want to put yourself in a corrupt and totally antidemocratic foreign system of crooks (EU) rather than with your brothers your own country for centuries?

    • Seán Rohan

      I am Irish..The English are definitely not “my brothers”…but the Scots deaerve to be EU partners instead of controlled by England

    • Daniel Suranyi

      Stefan: they are all brothers because they born in the same country as you? And they are all crooks because they are foreign? Interesting take on live…
      And to call a system democratic where your vote doesn’t count if the major party in your voting district has a sure majority is also an interesting take on democracy. You do known that the EU Parliament is voted for, right?

    • Paul X

      Rather than a weight, many EU members believe the UK has provided a much needed balance to control the rampant federalism of certain other countries

      …and a majority of Scottish people voted for the UK to remain in the EU, despite what Sturgeon would have you believe, that does not automatically mean that same majority want Scotland remain in the EU as an independent country

  19. EU Reform- Proactive

    How about scrutinizing the “EU”, by applying these popular pc (Brexit) comparatives to any “EU supranational“ democratic endeavors”? Including to expect full transparency- “beforehand”- of all still (unknown) “step by step”) EU nitty gritty unknowns?

    • Failure to agree & therefore not to possess a valid EU Constitutional Treaty.

    https://www.researchgate.net/publication/228235434_Explaining_the_Failure_of_the_European_Constitution_A_Constitution-Making_Perspective

    • Dismal low (43.09%) voter turnout at the (2014) EP elections.

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/300427/eu-parlament-turnout-for-the-european-elections/

    • No (significant) EU supranational referendum (ECI- bottom up) ever allowed by the EC to succeed…..

    https://democracy.blogactiv.eu/2016/04/21/eci-1-eus-citizens-initiative-a-useless-counterfeit-for-real-consultative-committees/

    Eurocates who live in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones……..”

  20. Jovan Ivosevic

    Enough drama with the Brits. The EU needs a lot of institutional reform to move forward and most of the necessary reforms are nonstarters to the UK. They have their coat and hat in hand. Time to make their way to the door.

  21. Magaly Morales

    The Brexit deal doesn’t include a trade deal because the EU can’t negotiate with a member so that referendum must take place at the end of the transitional period.

  22. Magaly Morales

    Besides the EU needs Britain out to advance on the European Project.
    Britain had and will oppose the European Project.

  23. David Fernandes Coelho

    The only thing I can say is I feel sorry for the normal english that voted stay because they will end up paying for the stupidy of those who voted out. The middle class in the UK will dissapear some of the richer will get poorer,and the elderly will suffer.

    • Paul Smith

      Or those who voted leave will pay with a watered down Brexit, due to the stupidity of those who voted remain 😁

    • Paul X

      “The middle class in the UK will dissapear some of the richer will get poorer,and the elderly will suffer.”…I don’t suppose you have any evidence to back up your fanciful predictions… I’d love to know where all the middle class are going to disappear to?

  24. Veronica Grigore

    Make list. What you will win and what you will loose . Compare and decid. For me to be independent is the most important but is a price for that.

  25. Karolina

    Yes, it should. It was a referendum that started the whole leaving process in a supposed exercise of democracy, so the same process should be followed to determine whether people accept the deal or want to stay in the EU or want to leave without a deal. You can’t only invoke democracy when it suits you because that is just manipulation and abuse.

    • Adrian

      Hahaha! Tears of LAUGHTER !! :D

      We are laughing our blue with gold stars asses off here ! :D

    • Adrian

      Adica le dam multa muie la britanici, ca asta merita.

  26. Gianfranco Coda

    a year and 1/2 on…
    Britons should by now have a more thoroughly view on what Brexit means to everybody…
    yes on a new referendum with a clear percentage of winning pre stated

    • Ugo Sais

      No. “Brexit means Brexit” and means CDS out of the City. We won’t miss you…

    • Adrian

      No
      ‘Brexit means brexit’
      And hopefully all the financial sector out of London.

      Good riddance !

  27. Gianfranco Coda

    a year and 1/2 on…
    Britons should by now have a more thoroughly view on what Brexit means to everybody…
    yes on a new referendum with a clear percentage of winning pre stated

  28. Anonymous

    a year and 1/2 on…
    Britons should by now have a more thoroughly view on what Brexit means to everybody…
    yes on a new referendum with a clear percentage of winning pre stated

  29. John Jones

    I would prefer to see a free vote in Parliament on the final deal. But what position will the UK move to if the vote is to stay in the EU? It cannot be business as before.

  30. Magaly Morales

    Europe have now a golden opportunity to advance towards a United States of Europe. That is the most positive thing in Europe for 20 years.

    • John Jones

      That is not going to happen. There has never been any plan to merge the member states into a single country. That has always been the myth put around by the English.

    • Magaly Morales

      John Jones 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂this has always been the EU. From the very beginning. Britain tried to stop that all throughout its membership. It has delayed but not stopped. The United States of Europe will be a reality now that its inside enemy is getting out.

    • Antoine Che

      The enemy is inside! EU is killing Europe…
      Even with the UK out it wants to use the language of the Anglo-Saxon Empire as our official language…

    • Magaly Morales

      Antoine Che that is not true. EU leaders have already said the status of English as Working language will end after Brexit.

    • Paul X

      English is the working language of business globally not just the EU, they are free to drop it but dont expect the rest of the world to start doing business in French or German just to suit the ego of the EU

  31. merkurio

    No. It is already out. Dont waste more european time and sod off already.

  32. catherine benning

    Should Britain have a referendum on the final Brexit deal?

    I don’t think so! The decision the British people made, was, as always for us, the right one.

    Should Britain have a referendum on the final Brexit deal?

  33. Stefan

    The British people did not know what they voted for in their first referendum. They clearly should be able to reject a badly negotiated Brexit deal in a second referendum.

    • Paul X

      Actually the ballot paper was quite clear..

      “Should the UK remain a member of the EU or leave the EU”

      SImple choice, no reference to “soft Brexit” or any other options

      Stay in or leave everything was the choice given, and we voted to leave everything about the EU, was pretty obvious to anyone who can read

  34. catherine benning

    @ Stefan

    The British people are a lot smarter than the rest of you Europeans. We are pragmatic. Not suffering from foolish delusions driven by fake propaganda.

    Ask this question of yourself. When did you personally vote for the EU leadership? Can you call for a no confidence vote and get rid of them? Do you know how much personal money they have in their various accounts and when it arrived for them? And, most importantly, where those assets and money came from?

    https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/904339/brexit-news-eu-uk-no-deal-free-trade-agreement-economists-for-free-trade

    • Adrian

      “The British people are a lot smarter than the rest of you Europeans”

      Ahhh the Dunning Krugger effect in action ^^

  35. John O'Neill

    The democratic vote was to leave, and leave we should. Those who try to oppose the peoples choice, by the use of their various negative opinions on the supposed final outcome of an actual deal are not helping the UK. The remainers seem to me to be a timid and frightened bunch opposed to change and new ideas, (this is not the way of the British People). They are trying to force their views on to the people by scare tactics which will make it harder to negotiate a fair and just outcome. Negotiations are never easy and no party are going to show their hand in negotiations, yet some fractions of the the British media seem to want to force this information from the Government and feed it to Brussels. Brussels in turn are using aggressive scare tactics via press releases which the UK media report, and which seems to be assisting them and making it more difficult for Theresa May and our Government to ensure we get a fair deal. If at the end of the negotiations we do not get a fair deal the remainers need to stand up and be counted, as it will not be the government’s fault. You cannot fight (negotiate) successfully with one hand tied behind your back. People will need to judge at the end of the negotiations who has influenced the final decision and if it is fair and just and if without the negativity we could have done better, as without doubt we will be leaving.

    • Mark Simons

      Well said

  36. kevin

    No because the referendum was about leaving or staying not on any final deal that the EU and the pro EU Tories come to .
    It doesn’t look like a final brexit deal will be anything other that a capitulation from the UK government where we keep paying in vast sums for access to various EU institutions . Only a Brexiteer leader in the future will take us out in the manor that 17 million people voted for .

  37. eusebio manuel vestias vestias

    Only the European institutions wish to continue to improve the lives of our people the UK will return the old days STOP BREXIT

    • Paul X

      What, like it has improved the lives of the people of Greece?

      The EU institutions have only one thing at heart, maintaining and expanding the EU

  38. Dave

    People had around 17 weeks to listen to the debates lies on both sides Camerons it may lead to war and Obama it may put back of the queue other eu countries threatening the uk the people of the uk were told that if we voted leave we would be leaving the single market and everything the eu has attached to it 17 million people voted leave 52% to 48% David Cameron the then prime minister said the vote would be respected since then I have seen little respect for the result the only people who don’t seem to understand what the vote was about are the people who voted remain and the people who didn’t vote on the 23 June 16 it was the biggest vote in UK history and the most important in UK history so a 2nd referumn we either leave with a good deal or leave no deal NO remaining we leave the eu.

    • Marko

      I hope my country will have its exit as well

    • Dave

      @Marko good luck

    • Diana

      It’s not gonna happen Marko. Unfortunately !

  39. Marko

    EU should stop subverting foreign and domestic democracies and personal freedoms. EU should stop waging war on its own people

    • Adrian

      Stop drinking bleach…

    • Ingrida

      But if another referendum shows remain, would it be possible to name it as a deal? 😄 It would be going against the nation. In fact, they needed another referendum much time earlier. Now – I do not know…

    • Ivan

      Making people vote until they get the right answer is the way the EU works. We are British, we have spoken and we are leaving the pointless EU. :)

    • John

      I wouldnt give up on elections. Here we have them every year. That’s democracy.

    • Duarte

      @Ivan the UK begged 3x to enter CEE. You kept begging until you got accepted so why not this time?

    • Ivan

      @Duarte Well done comrade for getting it right, we voted to join the EEC, not the pointless EU.

  40. Marian

    Contraproductiv si nepractic ca,stat de traditie, sa nu participe pentru o uniune stabila si economic perseverenta in cadrul european si mai mare.Avem necesitatea si necesarul de prioritati,reforme de amploare, revolutive de etapa industriala curata bazata pe obligativitatea responsabila a conduitei climatice in raport cu noile energii alternative.

    • Adrian

      Anglia are nevoie de un pumn in gura tare de tot.
      Lasa-i sa plece sa vezi ce isi sparg dintii de asfaltul de afara uniunii.

      Cred ca gigantii alde China, India si SUA ii vor menaja?
      Hahaha ce am sa ma distrez dp 2019.

  41. Jovan

    Britain is like this couple that’s has been leaving the party for the last 30 minutes but can’t seem to because they are fighting with each other. The rest of Europe has problems to solve not related to Europe, you said you were leaving, time to take your coats and get out already.

    • Ivan

      Don’t worry, all this staying in the pointless EU is just nonsense, we ARE leaving :)

    • Paul X

      …and the EU is the doorman at this party saying ” Despite the fact you were one of few people who brought booze for this party you have to provide even more before I will let you out the door”

  42. Carlos

    No one wants brexit, specially the brits. Never is too late to change what it never shouldn’t be changed. Better be happy then to have the reason, or in this case no reason at all.

    • Dave

      Think your find 17 million people voted to leave the eu don’t believe all bulls##t that the media would have you believe we love Europe but not the eu the eu have shown they don’t do democracy when there’s money involved.

  43. Fernando

    Best business UK never donde is Brexit. They will have to fight for their place on the world, reforce all their institutions like Commonwealth, stablish stronger links with Usa or China but they have an opportunity to be free of absurd bureaucracy and not democratic institutions and commisions.

  44. Svetoslav

    It’s all over now… too late for any of this. The Britons had their say. It’s in their politicians best interest to negotiate the best possible deal with the EU.

    • Ivan

      We don’t care if there is a deal or not. we just want out of the pointless EU :)

    • Svetoslav

      With the EU being UK’s largest trading partner, I think no deal will have negative consequences on UK’s economy, at least in the short run (3-4 years). So I understand why you guys want out, but trust me, you need at least some kind of a deal. Britain is an island but still it is closer to the EU than to the US or China and you can’t escape Geography.

    • Paul X

      Considering the UK has a trade deficit with the EU it is also in the EU’s interest to negotiate a good deal…… unfortunately, for those countries that export heavily to the UK, the EU is putting it’s own selfish political agenda before the needs of those countries

  45. Ivan

    We the British people have spoken & we the British people are leaving the pointless EU so no, there will not be another referendum. Does Debating Europe get any funding from George Soros ?

    • Sam

      I feel I keep having to point this out that I’m a British person and I didn’t say anything of the sort, please don’t presume to speak for me.

    • Ivan

      @Sam If you stand with traitors history will remember you as such comrade. If you think the EU is so wonderful will you be moving there ?

    • Sam

      First of all I’ll be spelling it right, second of all if all you can do is resort to cheap insults I guess you don’t have much of a real argument to make

    • Ivan

      Sam That’s pretty much the defence of Oswald Mosley and Kim Philby comrade & still they are remembered as traitor’s, how exactly are the followers of Soros & Blair any different ?

    • Sam

      What in the name of god are you going on about? What defence? Also, if you think calling me comrade is an insult you’re both mistaken and misunderstanding of the EU. I am a socialist and proud to be one, the EU however definitely isn’t so using that on me because I’m a europhile makes no sense. Perhaps you could familiarise yourself with some basic political concepts before yelling the odds.

    • Sam

      @Sam You seem to have a problem with reality comrade, here is the simple definition for you and to coin on old British saying ‘If the hat fits wear it’ & you do seem to have a thing for hats..

      Definition of traitor:-

      : A person who betrays his or her country

      : A person who seeks foreign rule over his or her country

    • Ivan

      @Sam

      Definition of Socialism:–

      (Other names include – Communism, Marxism & National Socialism)

      : A political ideology when implemented without exception leads to misery & decline and often civil or international war. Avoid at all costs.

    • David

      @Ivan – so indistinguishable from capitalism comrade. We voted to leave but not how. We should get a vote on how. And this time we won’t be fooled by lies because we will know what the deal is.

    • Sam

      😂. Ok, it was my own fault for getting lured into conversation.

    • David

      Don’t feel bad Sam. If nothing else your views make me feel that these bell ends will not win.

    • Sam

      When will I learn? I might as well try and knock down a wall with a feather. About as likely to happen as convincing an idiot of the truth using logic and facts.

    • Ivan

      @David You mean the 1973 lie that took us into the pointless EEC?, or maybe the lie that the sky would fall in if we voted to leave ? Forcing people to vote until they get the right answer is a trick used by Brussels before, it will not work again..

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YlXFssBHnRE

    • Sam

      You mean I could be getting PAID to make you say ever more stupid things? Man do I feel ripped off!

    • David

      @Sam the real problem is that a referendum is am awful way to decide government policy. Add to the fact that the standard of debate wad risible. Called by an arrogant rich boy to keep his party together, the whole campaign was conducted as a knockabout farce in a posh debating chamber between mendacious members fresh from risque experiences together in the showers of Eton. Or is that unfair?? You have to laugh……….

    • Ivan

      @David Irrelevant, we are leaving :)

    • David

      Good comeback Ivan

    • Ivan

      Thanks.So how exactly are you any different to Mosley & Philby comrade ?

    • David

      Dissimilar to Mosely because I am not a fascist – oh and not a racist either. Should have thought that was more your bag. Unlike Philby because I believe in representative democracy. Not quite sure how I could be similar to both given they are diametrically opposed on the political spectrum. Unless you are implying that they both followed a dictatorial political creed. In which case I would just point out that I would like another vote. What are you scared of?

    • Ivan

      @David And yet you would overturn the referendum result even though before it both sides said the result would be final ? .

      Oswald Mosely conspired to make the British people subservient to Berlin

      Kim Philby conspired to make the British people subservient to Moscow.

      You and your fellow remainers conspire to make the British people subservient to Brussels.

      Not really any different at all are you.

    • David

      When people vote they retain the right to change their mind. I say again, please concentrate, we voted to leave we did not vote on how. In the customs union? No OK avoiding a hard border with Eire? Yes. OK how will you do both? Do we want to lose “passporting rights with regard to dealing in European financial transactions? Are we prepared to leave summarily without a deal?? Did we actually vote to become poorer?? Incidentally “project fear said the roof could fall in if we leave. As we have not yet done that I am not surprised it is yet to occur. Overturn the decision?? Not me just want to be sure these idiots negotiating on my behalf do not make a complete pigs ear of it. I say again, given your commitment to the sanctity of the ballot box, what are you scared of??

  46. Kimmo

    By nature, referenda can really be only advisory, as was the Brexit one. We elect our parliaments to legislate, and our governments set policy. Why is everyone suddenly so intent on having referenda? “The will of the people” is often wrong, based on incomplete knowledge of the issues. Direct democracy translates into mob rule.

    • Adrian

      We want the UK to go away dammit, stop trying to educate them !

  47. Emil

    There is no need of a second referendum. They have already proved that this was useless since many people voted without really knowing what and why they were doing it and related to all of sorts of lies and fantasies to make their decision.

    • Adrian

      Exactly. KICK them out even if they want back in.

  48. Manuel

    No. Democracy and respect shouldn’t go in hand only when voters support our choice. ;-)

  49. Giovanni

    FINAL??? WHAT’S FINAL??? British People has ALREADY voted! Stop the violent soviet €U-propaganda!

  50. Ana

    No. Let them live the consequences of their decisions… at least for a while!

    • Adrian

      Preferably until they reach the level of Somalia.
      Then we can accept them crawling back…maybe.

  51. Luis

    No please. Let them go. I think they really don’t support the European Union Project. If years from now they are not as prosperous as the EU countries and they want a piece of it, like in the past, well they’re welcome.

    • Dave

      @Sam !! Not quiet true. We had a referendum to join the EEC and it was sold to the population as a trading partnership only, called the Common Market. No mention of political or monetary union.

  52. Kevin

    What part of divorce do you not understand? Mummy and Daddy are going their seperate ways. They will not live under the same roof. They will no longer share a bed. Now put your dummy back in and accept this fact and get on with your life. Daddy no longer wants contact or child maintenance payments for the bastardized, mutated, genetic experiment called the EU…….when the child aims to control the parent then you have a problem. Goodbye EU…you were not born naturally….you are the result of a cruel Government genetic experiment…..gone horribly wrong.

    • Sam

      As opposed to the really good way the UK was formed through feudal turf wars that eventually led to marriages between powerful families?

  53. Wendy

    I think people underestimate the anger and frustration of Brexiteers at the sly and dirty tactics being used by the losers to try and steal our victory from us. There is a deep sense of outrage and disgust at our treatment at the hands of the EU. The cloak of friendship and camaraderie is lifted and we see clearly which countries have become our enemies and seek to harm us. I feel we are poised on the edge of revolution and it will not take much to light the powder keg. A second referendum could do that.

    • Sam

      Name one way we’ve been mistreated by the EU.

    • Wendy

      You don’t think that demanding 40 billion from a friend before you will even enter talks is blackmail and extortion? You don’t think that the imposition of laws on a country that is no longer a member and can have no say in those laws is arm-twisting?
      How many more examples of a bullying dictatorship do you need? It isn’t just Britain now, is it?
      I presume you want Britain to become a province in a Soviet Union of Europe and are willing to fight for that cause against those who are willing to fight for freedom? I would love to see the convictions of snowflakes tested. I have a feeling they will melt when it comes to the actual confrontation they are driving us towards.

    • Sam

      I’m quite sure this will be read by blind eyes but here we go:
      The €40 billion is settling what we legally owe them and they’re well within their rights to ask for it. Don’t forget, were the ones leaving them, they aren’t kicking us out. The ‘imposition of laws’ is necessary for the transitional period that we asked for to stay in their single market. Can you name a single example of something done before we voted to leave? One?
      Also, this relentlessly hysterical response about them taking our freedom and being the next Soviet union is ridiculous, and if you knew the methods used by the Soviets to keep their subject republics under control you’d know that.
      Just tell me what they’re doing to ‘take our freedom’.

    • Tiago

      Why do you want friendship when less than half of your country wanted to destroy the life of millions of European citizens? Brexiters get what they deserve! Who is taking the freedom is not EU but your country. Your attitudes and actions are undermining the freedom of millions of British people who feel embraced by their fellow Europeans and want to be free to move and to cooperate with other European citizens.

    • Wendy

      We do not “legally” owe them anything. In fact. they”legally” owe us quite a bit. If you cannot see what is happening right in front of your eyes then you are either blind or one of Soro’s paid shills.
      All your arguments have been put to the British people and rejected. We want to leave the EU. It rips us off, milks us dry, steals our fish, overrules our laws, wants to control our army, our borders, and impose taxes on us. I’m afraid you are a lost cause, you are the brainwashed enemy who has been trained to speak euroslobber. You need to leave Britain and go live in the super state you desire so much. If the EU is so great then why oh why are the elders, who should be respected and not sneered at, so determined for us to leave? You don’t even know that you’re a slave, do you? Some of us remember real freedom and true democracy.

    • Wendy

      @Tiago – the solution is simple, those who want to be part of the EU should move there. There’s nothing to stop them. Why should immigration only go in one direction? Perhaps when Spain and Portugal unite you won’t be so keen on the idea of being annexed.

    • Sam

      I love this line of argument from the Brexitards. ‘Britain for the British. Unless you disagree with me then you should leave.’ I’ve asked you twice now for a specific reason you have to say the EU is doing bad things to us or takes our freedom and you haven’t done anything except repeat the lies published in the Express and the Mail and then yammer on incoherently about democracy and freedom with no reference to specific ways the EU supposedly threatens those things.

    • Wendy

      You are repeating the same old Blair, Clegg, Mandleson gravy-train dribble. They’ve all sold out to the EU, just like you.
      For your information, The Express has been bought out by the lefties to further suppress our freedom of speech so you will need to dump that tired old argument which you have poached from the pages of the Guardian.
      I have given you sufficient reasons but that won’t stop you working your way through your script. I know the method is to keep repeating the same questions and then dismiss all my answers as me parroting the right wing press. Your type never explain where your own sycophantic euromania comes from. Where is your unique source of information that is not tainted by the left? You’re obviously not British and you probably hate the British. So I welcome the day that you and your ilk are banished from our country and obliged to return to whatever country had the misfortune to spawn you.

    • Sam

      More things I keel explaining:
      Being europhillic has nothing left wing about it. The European parliament is dominated by centre right parties and the EU is widely criticised by the left wing as being a neoliberal club. As it happens I’m a socialist, yes. You gave vague answers about forcing laws on us (not true), wanting to control our army (not true), stealing our fish (not true), but no actual specifics. What laws have been imposed without our parliament’s say so exactly? What evidence is there that the EU want to control our army?
      Incidentally, I am British. The things I’m proud of about my country are our reputation for sensible decisions and historical commitment to international engagement, neither if which is demonstrated by the name-calling, baseless accusations and xenophobia in that revolting response.

    • Wendy

      You have no right to be proud of our country. You are a traitor. Troll off.

    • Jay

      I was born in the british Isles but I do not like the “united kingdom” it is a disgusting regime that has a long history of human rights abuses its leaders are power/money hungry and deliberately and persistently try to conflate its name ¨the United Kingdom¨ with the lands of Britain to deliberately confuse the british people (on both sides of the water ie. Brittany france). I am fundamentally European as Britain is a geographically area of EUROPE. By voting to separate, all you have done is chosen to be rules by a small more inbreed group of tyrants than a large group of tyrants. oh well, I suppose you stand a better chance of taking them out this way. but as long as the european people remain divided the elites will rule. The british population is being head-f**ked by the regime´s propaganda apparatus. Its such a sad thing to witness. I, for one, have not hung around to watch this situation deteriorate further. There are many sunny and interesting places on this planet to explore and live and MANY of them don´t give a toss about the trivial goings-on of north-western europe.

    • Wendy

      What a load of rubbish. It isn’t even written by someone who speaks fluent English. No Briton would ever claim to be born in the British Isles. We all know which part of the United Kingdom we are from. The propaganda is all aimed at keeping us within the Fourth Reich. But we will liberate ourselves because we have the guts to do it.

    • Matt

      @Jay they only person who has been “head fucked” is you boy. Talking out your arse

    • Paul X

      @ Jay
      Guess what, post Brexit you can still call yourself European, that is a geographical fact that cannot be voted away
      What we have elected to leave is the EU which is an unnecessary, profligate bureaucracy trying to exert domination over the continent of Europe

      …and human rights abuse wasn’t exclusive to the UK, I suggest you will find just as much historical abuse in the history of many European countries……some of which is much more recent than anything that can be blamed on the UK

  54. Wendy

    @Liri – Maybe we should march into your country and dictate to your people how they should be ruled and what alliances they should belong to.

  55. Matt

    No. Brexit means we leave the eu, totally. No single market no nothing. Just out

  56. Γεώργιος

    Brexit has been done.Question is.Should remaining 28 countries have a referendum on exit from dying EU governed by a staff of market sharks and warmongers without democratic procedures?

  57. Jude

    YES….europe without Britain is meaningless. …incomplete….we need a breath of democracy. ..and only Britain can supply it.

    • Adrian

      This.
      The EU should sigh in relief.

  58. Stephen Morgan

    Do you think the general public had enough or the right information to vote On what was best for our country ?

    • Paul X

      They knew that following Cameron’s total failure to get any worthwhile concessions that the EU is hell bent on its own course and the way it is heading is not what the majority of people in the UK want. It also proved that any claims that we could stay in and “reform it from within” are a total fantasy

      The problem at the moment is people selectively pick on individual topics when debating the pro and cons of Brexit e.g. immigration, NHS funding, trade etc…….where as the fundamental reason for Brexit is more basic than that, it is that the EU is a profligate, inefficient bureaucratic organisation with an agenda to justify and perpetuate its own existence, all done at great expense to the European taxpayers

  59. David

    No, it has been already done. As the referendum has an advisory role, it’s time for parliament to study and make a decision on this complex topic.
    Note that I’m french, living in Poitou a region under english control during 300 years during Middle Age. Good luck friend and neighbour !

  60. Eusebio

    It should also be said that Brexit receives less attention in the EU27 because negotiation have become smoother and have seen substantial progress so it is welcome for both parties

  61. Adrian

    And if they vote they don’t like it what then?
    Are we in the EU supposed to say ” oh ok we’ll take you back then and give you opt outs again” ?

    Hell no. Let them go out – preferably with zero deals.

required
required Your email will not be published

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

Notify me of new comments. You can also subscribe without commenting.

More debates from this series – Brexit – Britain’s place in Europe View all