refugees_post_9

Several European countries have refused proposals for an EU-wide system of refugee quotas. Leaders from countries including the Czech Republic, Hungary, Poland and Slovakia have also drawn international criticism for publicly questioning the policy of “Christian countries” taking in Muslim refugees.

Only Slovakia has gone so far as stating it will outright refuse to accept non-Christian refugees (in breach of EU law), but others have hinted that they strongly prefer not to take in Muslim refugees. Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orbán, for example, has said his country has the “right to decide that we do not want a large number of Muslim people”, while the Interior Minister of Cyprus confirmed on public radio that Cyprus also prefers to host only Christians (and, ideally, Eastern Orthodox Christians at that).

In Hungary, meanwhile, the government has been overwhelmed by thousands of people fleeing from ISIS and the brutal civil war in Syria. As part of its response to the refugee crisis, Hungary is currently building a 175km-long razor-wire fence to keep people out.

Western European leaders have been quick to condemn both Slovakia’s asylum policy and Hungary’s fence, but they have also been criticised themselves for failing to provide adequate support to those EU countries – like Hungary, Greece, and Italy – that are on the front line of the refugee crisis.

Nevertheless, French President François Hollande recently made a thinly-veiled swipe at both Slovakia and Hungary in particular, saying: “There are some countries that would like to pick and choose the refugees they host in the name of ethics or religion. There are some countries that would like to build walls. What would these countries have thought when the [Berlin] wall came down if we had said: ‘Don’t come, stay where you are, wait.”

We had a comment sent in from Bastian, arguing that he fully supports Hungary’s fence, and adding that he thinks Hungary is the only country in Schengen taking ‘rule of law seriously’ when it comes to the refugee crisis.

To get a response, we took Bastian’s comment to Timothy Kirkhope, a British Conservative MEP and member of the European Parliament Committee on Civil Liberties, Justice and Home Affairs. What would he say to Bastian’s comment?

We also spoke to Babar Baloch, UNHCR Spokesperson for Central Europe, currently based in Budapest, Hungary. How would he respond?

balochFrom UNHCR’s point of view, we think walls and fences are not an answer to a refugee crisis. If there’s an agreement that seeking international protection and asylum is not a crime, then there’s no point putting an obstacle in the way of a refugee population. However, I think Hungary has actually maintained access to their territory. People have been allowed to come in – so far we have seen over 145’000 people who have claimed asylum – but what we are looking for from Hungary is a better process of registration of these people.

But we also go a step further and say that countries like Hungary, Italy, and Greece, should be helped by other European states as well. In our view, no one country can take care of these people single-handedly, so we’re asking for Europe to please come forward and have 200’000 relocation spaces for countries like Greece, Hungary, and Italy, when they register people. This responsibility needs to be shared.

Finally, we’ve had a lot of readers saying they are concerned about the social impact of so many Muslim refugees coming to Europe. This is precisely the argument put forward by countries like Slovakia when they say they would prefer not to accept non-Christian asylum applications. How would Babar Baloch address these concerns?

balochThe principle of asylum goes beyond religion, race, ethnicity, social standing, and things like that. It’s a very basic human right that the international community has agreed upon. We have said that you cannot base your criteria on discrimination, helping one group and refusing another. In terms of the social impact, I say again that it’s a humanitarian consideration. We know that these people are direly in need of international protection.

We see that, throughout the world today, there are 20 million refugees. Not all of them are coming to Europe; in fact, over 90% of the world’s refugee population is hosted in developing or least-developed countries. So, there are 300’000 coming to Europe, and Europe can deal with them, Europe has the resources. But we are looking for the political will and understanding from the general public, because if you come [to Hungary] and go to the border and see women, children, and families that have been through a lot of trauma, we need to find an answer. And I’m sure that everybody, as humans, would like to help. This is the understanding we try to seek.

Are countries like Slovakia wrong to accept only Christian refugees? Do EU Member States have the right to decide they do not want ‘a large number of Muslim people’? Or does the principle of asylum go beyond religion, race, and ethnicity? Let us know your thoughts and comments in the form below, and we’ll take them to policymakers and experts for their reactions!

IMAGE CREDITS: CC / Flickr – Rebecca Harms


492 comments Post a commentComment


    • Stavros Ioannides

      Greeks were welcomed, not during II WW but during the genoside by the Turks in 1923. The Syrians considered them harmless and never a threat to the Syrian culture, religious and social system. They never carried alongside toxic ideologies in their new host countries and never demanded to change their host country’s society to align it to the Greek orthodox religious system.
      On the other hand, the failure of refugees in Europe during the last 30+ years to assimilate and the obvious cultural inconsistency betwwen them and the europeans has been the root cause of withdrawal and radicalization at the expense of the indigenous populations.

    • Dave

      No Muslims should be sent to Africa.There they can practice their religion. Why screw up the rest of the world withy Muslims

    • dazman

      I think after the attacks on France, then I`m afraid it’s just unfortunate that muslims, innocent ones, will have to be left out of a country. Very difficult to work out the isis ones from the peaceful ones. Then again, hard to work out genuine refugees from the violent ones. I didn`t say it was right or wrong, but currently it’ll only be the way to defend a country against this situation.

    • Ana

      That’s a hilarious joke!
      Greeks FOUGHT the Nazi Germans and due to their COURAGE and RESISTANCE Europe got free from them. Greeks DID NOT leave the country carrying their problems into other countries like Syrians do at the moment creating a chaotic situation all over Europe….
      WHEN did the Syrians ever care about the WW2? Did they send troopers/financial support to the UK, France, Italy, Greece etc. to fight against Nazi Germans? What particularly have the Syrians done apart for Europeans from creating chaos in each country?
      Better study a bit of history before saying nonsense online don’t you think?

    • Paul Alleyne

      Did any of those Greeks go on to commit terrorist attacks in Muslim countries?
      How many Islamic terror attacks and attempted terror attacks have we had in Western Europe since 911?

    • gabriel

      I don’t know about WW2, but during WW1 the Pontic Greeks were subject to genocide by Muslims, as well as Armenians and Assyrians in the Ottoman Empire, all because they were Christians. Mr. Erdogan’s Turkey, who is now giving us lessons of humanity, to this day still denies that genocide.
      There is only one Muslim nation who officially recognized that genocide: Assad’s Syria early this year! Of course Assad did that because a new genocide is being perpetrated by Muslim fanatics against Christians in the Middle East and he’s trying to raise an alarm signal (unsuccessfully).

    • Stavros Ioannides

      Greeks were welcomed but were also considered harmless and never a threat to the Syrian culture, religious and social system. They never carried alongside toxic ideologies in their new host countries and never demanded to change their host country’s society to align it to the Greek orthodox religious system.
      On the other hand, the failure of refugees in Europe during the last 30+ years to assimilate and the obvious cultural inconsistency betwwen them and the europeans has been the root cause of withdrawal and radicalization at the expense of the indigenous populations.

    • Jordan

      It’s insanity to allow a culture into an established healthy society whose values go contrary to democracy. The majority of those from the middle eastern culture does not share western values or believe in democracy. The model from which they operate from (Islam / koran) is one that clouds their thinking and what gives rise to cultural conflict that will only grow with time. We would be wise to not let them in – rather help them establish peace within their own countries that are riddled with corruption. Those that are allowed in should be educated on our system of beliefs and should assimilate and add value rather than be on the receiving end. No hijabs, birkas, skull caps or any religious wear in public should be tolerated. This sets the stage for massive social problems. Muslims must show respect and wear their religion in their hearts and NOT on their heads. When I walk down the street I don’t want to know you are Muslim – I want you know you are Canadian or Australian (whatever kind host country took you in). Better yet – learn from your host country and go back home to establish a country of peace for your selves as Christians have done.

    • Aryan Deoskar

      Exactly, and there are even economical points and examples.
      there are countries that have taken in refugees (Turkey) and have had their GDP increase by 4%
      The influx of refugees also has a very positive impact on a country

  1. Gerry Mavrie-Yanaki

    It would be more accepted in European Communities if French Laws on banning the Burqa and secular laws were adopted accros all of the European Union.

    • k.bekei

      Europe should become secular and by all means ban the Burqa as well. That would be a good start.

  2. Christos Mouzeviris

    They have the right to decide yes, absolutely when it comes to economic migrants… Refugees are not economic migrants!! They should be treated differently! They deserve shelter!

    • Emma

      Not if all they do is cause chaos, which is what they’re doing. It’s more than alright to expect refugees to be grateful and not cause trouble. The Syrians seem to have not heard that.

    • TRINITY 24

      I think countries in situations like this should first think of safety of their own people and as EU can’t guarantee there are no terrorists hidden between them, countries have full right to decide who can enter their country.

  3. Stephen Panev

    Оf course they are right to many muslims is bad. They should denounce their religion.

    • Steven Berkow

      The day we are born we are all the same, but Islam creates a different mindset, look at Islamic countries, womaen are second class, christians are disciminated and persecuted, there is lots of intolerance and war, you simpy cannot claim that cross=crescent, to claim this is to proove your own ignorance in religious questions.Its not christians trying to kill people on airplanes!

    • AJ

      @Steven. Women are second class in Europe too. It does not matter if officially there is equality. Islamic discrimination is more blatant and the European more subtle. But that does not change the fact that it’s prevalent everywhere. In Europe, Muslims are discriminated against. I have had in-your-face racist experiences in Eastern and Western Europe (although I’m pretty sure even the most racist in the west would be surprised just how far they take it in the eastern parts).

      “Its not christians trying to kill people on airplanes”. Ah, no, of course not. The NATO airforces, the ISAF warplanes, the lovely drones, they are all manned by Muslims right?

    • grace

      Aaah, Milos. “A person is a person”. Like we are all brothers. Only there are some brothers who decapitate innocent people, then photograph themselves holding up their heads.

    • James Campbell

      The issue highlights the fact that we are not a single demos. While the EU has continued its merry way towards political integration, the peoples of its countries have generally not been consulted on changes which affect their cultures deeply. When push comes to shove on big issues like this one, they express their views and the EU then has the temerity to condemn them as intolerant for not getting with the programme; when in fact they were never consulted about the consequences of free movement in the first place.

      Having said that, people who come from other EU countries e.g. Poland, to the UK and settle in big numbers, tend not to complain openly of having to live alongside Muslims in the UK. So there are some double standards at work too.

  4. Karel Van Isacker

    Europe is mainly Christian. So of course taking into account the troubles already created by muslim minorities in most countries this should not be worsened by an influx of radicals and intolerant muslims.

  5. Любомир Иванчев

    Religion shouldn’t be a criteria at all here. Christian fundamentalists are not in any way better than muslim fundamentalists. Not to mention that religion is a major reason for these refugees being refugees in the first place!

    • Steven Berkow

      When was the last time you were scared of Christian fundamentalists?

  6. Björn Eric Ingemar Grahn

    It goes way beond. Besides how care if you are chrisian or muslim iˋs part of the same religon anyway. (Same god same religon. Yus the direction differs)

    • Amanda Meyer

      Björn, I suppose you are from Sweden, in the next 3-5 decades Sweden will be Islamic if the current course continues, so you should not be a guide on how to do Immigration policy, to claim that its all the same anyways is madness, not one muslim would claim such a thing, you are a foolish foolish cultural relativist, unbelievable how foolish.

    • EU reform- proactive

      …….your ancestor gods Odin, Thor & Freya just turned in their graves-did you hear it?

    • Hanaljay

      Although geopolitical issues more complex fair point in principle.

  7. Vinko Rajic

    I think it is problem about integration . If they want to integrate than is excellent , if they don’t want than is a huge problem. Croatia has a terrible and really good experience with immigrants/refugees . Very good was Germans , many Germans moved to Croatia for 150-450 Years , Germans and Croatians mixed together and Germans in Croatia accepted to become Croatians so you have Croats with German family names and many Germans changed to Croatian family names , the same thing did many Croatians in Austria . Jews had a terrible history in Croatia , different religion and they never integrate , terrible history finished under WW2 , over 90% ( about 25 000 ) was killed by Nazis . SERB created the biggest problem in Croatian history :
    Croatia received many refugees 1737–1739 , they never tried to integrate them and that created the biggest problem in Croatian history . After Turk invasion on Serbia many Serbs moved to Croatia . Croats and Austrians accepted them but that created a big problem after short time because they was Orthodox and all others Catholics. They had big fighting many times and under WW2 Germans and Croatians tried to kill all of them just to finish that conflict . They did’t killed them just because Croat – Josip Broz Tito and his partisans saved most of them but Croatia had a war against them again 1991-1995 . Croatia had a 600,000-strong Serbian minority, descendants of Serbs who had fled Turkish rule centuries earlier. With the memory of Second World War atrocities behind them, the Serbs were unwilling to live in an independent Croatia again. For their part, the Croats viewed the Serbian minority as a group that had enjoyed special privileges under Communism. http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/the-bosnia-crisis-serbs-croats-and-muslims-who-hates-who-and-why-tony-barber-in-zagreb-traces-the-ancient-roots-of-a-culture-clash-that-has-shattered-what-was-yugoslavia-into-warring-pieces-1539305.html

    • Billy Henderson

      The croats and the muslims from the former Yugoslavia countries are the nazis. They always blame the serbs for everything. During the ww1 croat and muslim divisions, under the rule of AU monarchy, slaughterd hundreds of thousands civilian serbs in Serbia. During ww2 croats and muslims again, slaughtered serbs, together with germans and italians. In both wars they committed genocide towards the serbs. Tito once said in his speech that 40% procent of partisans, were serbian nationality and he never said that he was a croat. Evidence suggest that he was in fact a foreigner. He always claimed, that he was a Yugoslav. Couple of months before the civil war in Yugoslavia began, croat paramilitary forces in the area of Krajina in Croatia and elsewhere in Croatia, started attacking serbian civilians living there. They for example broke windows on their homes. So as you see, not all americans are dumb to belive that serbs are the only quilty party for the things that happened in Yugoslavia. Serbs did two large mistakes. They should have not accepted Croatia after the ww1 in their kingdom and the other mistake is that during the last war in Yugoslavia, they did not go only to war, but a lot of them commited war crimes towards the croats and muslims in the name of vengeance for all the bad that things that happened to their ancestors, familys etc.

    • Edi R.

      Billy Henderson your bias toward the radical Serbian interpretation of the West Balkans history comes either from indoctrination or lack of information. It is the old tradition of Serbian radicals to scream ‘Nazis Nazis’ whenever they are caught redhanded. So the Croats and Muslims are Nazis because they wanted independence, Kosovars ie Albanians are Nazis for the same reason, Bill Clinton and Nato were nazi because of the military intervention, etc. And dont throw in the argument of poor Serbs committing war crimes because of bad memories from WW2 and old crimes by all sorts of Nazis against the Serbians. And just one question do you happen to know that the pro-Nazi Serbian collaboration government in WW2 led by Nedic effectively exterminated all the Jews from Serbia – in the same way the pro-nazi Croatian government did it in Croatia? In your mind this is not bevause both countries had pro-Nazi collaborationists, but rather because the Serbs have been inflicted with the old wounds by the state of Israel which,actually, did not exist at the time but poor Serbian collaborationists felt it anyway????

    • Zoka

      Hello,

      every single word what Billy Henderson said about muslims and croats in the balkans is true. I live in Bosnia and you Edi R. wrote a lot of nonsense. Most of the time in the bloody balkan history Serbs were the victims. That is the truth. Edi R. before the War in Yugoslavia, Lord Owen had a great idea of making from Bosnia 3 new countries. One would be Srbian, other Croathian and third muslim. But the muslims did not want that. They wanted to dominate the entire country and that is way the war started. Edi R. Billy Henderson wrote that majority of partisans were Serbs. And majority of Serbian civilians were againts the nazis. This scum Nedic that you mention was one of only few Serbian nazis leaders. They were callled the chetniks, who were Serbian fascists. They fought againts partisans who were Serbian and other nationality. Even the yugoslaving king Karadjordjevic did not want to have anything to do with Nedic. Edi R. About the albanians if it is ok for them to get independence, why dosent USA and Nato give independence to Serbs and Croats from Bosnia? Majority Srbs, croats and muslims that I know are good people. But Edi R. and Vinko Rajic, stop blaming Serbs for everything. Edi R. most the things you wrote I repeat are nonsense and weird. I live in Bosnia and now the truth about this region as you do not.

  8. Jorge Lux

    Of course not! They are clever cause they know that muslims are not compatible with modern society’s.

  9. Carlos Pinheiro

    Of course they’re wrong. Why Christian’s? The biggest terrorist attack in Europe in this decade was the responsibility of a white christian (Norway – 2011). Muslim’s, Indus, Buddhist’s, or any other religion is secondary.

    They are all human being in need of help. It is our duty to help the ones in need and escort out the ones that don’t need any help at all.

    Is it difficult sometimes to distinguish? Of course, but this process as to be done urgently and humanely.

    • Thomas Anderson

      I dont support his actions, but he did it because of Islam, he wanted to stop the Islamization, he didnt target anyone except those responsible for the government policy, he could easyily have bombed a mosque, but he chose to attack the policy makers. Violence has no place in politics.

  10. Iordachescu Sorin

    No, they are not!!!! Why should my country become a smaller France, stashed with muslims and bad habits? Or a little Britain with muslims taking over entire cities, by viloence and religion!

    • Raphaella

      You are correct. Some parts of the UK are now a no-go if you are not Muslim & look at the problem the schools in Birmingham are facing. these people did not integrate, they set up independent muslim states living off British taxpayers.

      Governments leaders open your eyes. look at Britain & France. Do not be stupid & think that 1000s of people from cultures that have honour killings, cultural paedaphilia will become model citizens, learning your language, customs & integrating to build up your countries & it has nothing to do with religion – in most African & Asian countries you can’t distinguish muslims from christians etc as they all dress & act alike.

      Honour killings has become the biggest form of child abuse in the uk, after female genial mutilation – brought in by refugees AND economic migrants. You need to be careful WHO you take into your home – that is just common sense.

  11. Rita Cortis Coleiro

    ISIS In Syria…. Syrians could not leave because of ISIS, ISIS Still In Syria… Yet Syrians are invading Europe…. Real refugees still in camps… ISIS States it sent Thousands mingled with refugees..Make your own Homework!!! Gaddhafi`s Prophecy has come to be True!!

  12. Costin Halaicu

    If we start discriminating on religious grounds, then it would mean we have gone back 100 years. We need to look back and learn from the mistakes of the past, not turn the Muslims of the 21st century into the 20th centuries’ Jews.

    • Francois P

      The difference between muslims and jews is that jews didnt do terrorism in the name of HaShem, muslims are killing Christians in their own countries in the name of allah, now that they are second and thrid generation in Europe they are killing christians in Europe in the name of Allah, another 3 generations and it may very well be a full scale Syria style war, this scenario must be averted at all cost, if not then we will lose our peace & freedom.

    • k.bekei

      We’re discriminating on cultural grounds. Europe lives in the 21st century with science, technology, medicine and great painters and sculptures and so on. Muslims are stuck in the dark ages. They destroy their old archaeological sites, art, sculptures. They make no progress in the sciences, medicine or technology. The concept of democracy is lost on them. They only care about Islam and Sharia Law. When was the last time Muslims made any contribution to mankind? Or won the Nobel Prize?

      They now expect to impose their backward thinking and culture on Europe so what, we can all slide back to the days when the catholic church burned those who said the world was round? Discriminate away or become like the UK with its Muslim only communities and violence. Sad part is they’re not even interested in being educated. Quite frankly we should take all their western technology away from them until they learn how it all works.

  13. Steffen Ehrecke

    Well apparently, humanity is something alien to many here… In my opinion it is human decency to let people into your own home that are being persecuted and are fleeing from war, regardless of religion, culture or whatever else….
    By the way: I find it disgusting that so called Christians are preaching their moral superiority left and right but can’t be swift enough to deny help to the weak…

    • grace

      Yeah sure, but if I let someone into my home, they wouldn’t get to choose which bedroom they got, they would want to ask and not demand anything, and they would never end up running my household. They would be my guests and if they didn’t play nice, I would show them the say out.

    • grace

      Oh, and they wouldn’t leave their sh*t all over the floor.

    • grace

      Also, there is a difference between someone asking to be let in and 100 people breaking in.

    • Raphaella

      Grace is absolute correct. Guests ask, not demand. If they attempt to destroy you then you tell them to leave, not ask them to leave. Please also remember that the UK has a massive SOCIAL CARE problem – senior citizens are not being cared for in many homes, many children are born to immature & selfish parents & end up in care where they are not cared for properly. the UK needs to sort out these home issues plus others, before you take in others that are going to add to social care problems. Don’t forget OIL RICH Saudi Arabia can take 2 MILLION people – it does so every year, so that is where they should be going.
      UK sort out SOCIAL CARE & CHILD POVERTY before you take in people who are going to add to the crazyiness.

  14. Ivan Burrows

    .

    Albania, Kosovo, parts of Bosnia and Herzegovina,Bulgaria, Montenegro and Macedonia are all Muslim-majority regions of Europe.

    Are they not ‘Europeans’ or is the term ‘European’ meaningless ?

    • k.bekei

      Then send them all there. That’s fair and we can send aid and they can sort them out.

  15. Elena Henriques

    So next we are claming to only white and then only right wing. What’s the matter with us europeans? This question looks like from Orwell’s Animal farm :(

  16. Claudio Joao

    No one can ask for themselves something that they refuse to give to others.
    In this case: respect and tolerance for different points of view.
    All muslim countries are highly against other religions beeing on their land.
    As far as I know, all other religions seek some kind of balance. They might not agree with your beliefs, they might say you’ll burn in hell for eternety….but they won’t hit or insult you “feeely”.
    Islam is the “bully”, the one that believes that by birthright is superior to all other religions and thereofore, all others have no right to exist and should be erased. all means to that end are justifiable.
    True, we were once on that situation, we raided most african countries and beyond for their resources. But a different time, everyone else has evolved and a lot has come from that – arts, sports, culture and all the beautifull things we have, and al the universally tolerant principles.
    But now, I see this, and I think the question is:

    What are you willing to do, to defend your point of view. If nothing is done, I’m sure that all the modern European ideals of tolerance and freedom will be lost.

  17. Cristina Rodrigues Pereira

    Yes they are, the discrimination will push the ones that are escaping the fundamentalists into their arms…But the crimes inside the boats must be punished and the murderers sent back, no matter what religion they practise, to their home countries. The traffickers must be severely punished.

    • Emma

      So you’re just fine with letting in millions of potential jihadists that’d rather see you beheaded than tolerate a cartoon of Muhammad?

    • Francois P

      Say this the next time youre at the airport and they swab your hands and make you take off you shoes.

    • Ana

      …in the time where Syrians helped Europeans so now we should return the favour back by turning our countries into the same shit as the Middle East countries who always have problems due to religious issues, right? What a fair comparison my dear!

    • k.bekei

      No, we wouldn’t be welcomed, especially since we’re not Muslims. The same way Saudi Arabia doesn’t want them, wrong type of Muslims.

    • Paulo Mendes

      We did and only to sow death and destruction. I believe people are paranoid because they believe in karma….

    • Ana

      I’m with you! So, lets turn all European countries into Muslim countries and then I want to hear you saying the same thing “religion is a thorn between people”…

  18. Ingo Vonsundahl

    Were those people ever asked if they agree with colonialism, post war border decisions, totalitarian regims being supported by the EU and the US or weapons being imported by the EU?

  19. Σαντυ Μπαλμπαγάδη

    The issue is the people of the countries.It is not important what goverments will say but what the people decide through referendums.You can’t press the nations because eventually they will explode.There is a truth that the EU can’t accept.Many nations want to keep their identity and they can not be called facists or heartless because their own nation comes first.

    • k.bekei

      Well said.

  20. Franck Legon

    the term refugee is more than questionable : the only ones among migrants 20% of Syrian refugees fleeing the war, 80% are economic migrants from other sources , it is for more than 2/3 of men, they are young people, healthy, fail to serve their country, but German industry by working even cheaper at the expense of German workers already underpaid. the media are lying to you . http://www.voltairenet.org/article188608.html when we could settle the issue militarily in two weeks we allow Islamist reign for years on the Middle East , terrorize and massacre the population , reinforce the point that they will soon have biological weapons to attack us , all of it for reasons of oil, big money and struggle for influence between the US and the Russian Fed., and height of cynicism , our leaders use it to manipulate

    • Angie

      Yes we should settle this once and for all.

  21. Andre Lopes

    the question is, if you are the refugee, would you like to be in this generic racist no sense paranoia?

    • George

      They come here because they want to. They are not forced to come to Europe. They pay to be smuggled in!

    • Kate Calder

      @George: Or, depending on your perspective, they leave their homes because they’re forced to; Europe is the nearest relatively stable region; they pay to be smuggled out.

      It seems popular amongst the European media, and their readers, to ascribe motivations and desires to these people. Have they *chosen* to leave their war-torn home country? Well, I suppose they have – just as I would if my own land became too dangerous for me to feel safe there.

      Wouldn’t you?

      And yes, in that situation, I’d be looking around for a good, reliably safe place to go. And then I’d go there. And I might well need help to make the arrangements, which means paying someone to help me. I’d hope I’d be discerning over who to ask for that help, since there’d certainly be many people out to exploit me – but I guess that depends how immediate the danger feels.

      So people who choose to leave their homes, choose to come to Europe, choose to pay people to smuggle them in – those people wouldn’t warrant aid or support.

      People who are forced from their homes, flee to the nearest safe space (and why are we all so surprised when they come through Europe to Germany or Britain or France, when these countries are clearly the furthest away from the place they’re fleeing?), and put their lives in the hands of exploiters – smugglers, pirates, slavers – rather than face the dangers of staying at home… It’s somewhat disheartening to see so many people who just can’t empathise with any of that. Perhaps we take our advantages for granted.

    • George

      I don’t think you’ve even got the gist of it, Kate…

    • Kate Calder

      Perhaps not. But unless someone’s willing to explain why I’ve got it all wrong, it’s likely I’ll continue to labour under the misunderstanding; and that isn’t going to do any good.

      You understand it better than I do, so why not put me right?

  22. Reno Zeddi

    Honestly no. We have to do anything we could do to save and accept more people. I’m an atheist and I don’t care about religious, for me you deserve to live and dignity whatever your faith is.

  23. Paul Reichberg

    Of course.
    People are people they are all human beeings.
    Wrong question

    • Francois P

      Humans with a culture that discriminates and persecutes christians, so the question of allowing muslims to come into christian countries is 100% legitimate.

    • grace

      Some humans decapitate other human beings and video themselves doing it.
      No humans are not all the same.
      I love children very much, but unfortunately some children will also become monsters.

  24. Thomas Hou

    I can’t believe that debating Europe brings up such a disciminatory debate. We won’t let politicians use the religion to rule the people. Long live to laicism !

  25. Πόπη Γεωργοπούλου

    They would be wrong in the past times. Not today that radical Islam is used by the West in order to persecute any other religion or culture. European people are not compatible with neoliberalism which prefers Neantertal masses, so we must somehow react and not play their game. On the other hand, most victims of butchers called ISIS are mousli Syrian, Kurds, Iraqui, etc.

    • Ana

      Like you said… “like-minded people”.
      Since when Muslims are like minded to Germans/Brits/French etc.?
      Am I missing something all these years?

  26. Alexandre Caldeira

    Muslim or kopta cristian or whatever is not a value reason for not give asylum. If europe enter in war with russia, magreb recuse us asylum cause we cristian? We should accept everyone as we would want then to receive our children.
    EU should be frontal and inform asylum is not a rigth to stay undefinatly. is temporary. EU should filter possible ISIS MENBERS within the refugee, and engage war against the tirans of siria and isis,so the refugee can retirn to their own country safe.

    • Elizabeth

      How do you filter possible ISIS members? If you knew, you would be a very rich man!

    • Oliver Meto

      And the alternative, millions of muslims migrate to Western Europe, answer this will there be more or less terrorism and dead European Christians?

  27. Ferenc Lázár

    I have 1 very important question- how come that these Muslim people aren’t going in large numbers to Saudi Arabia, Dubai, Kuweit? Why only Europe is responsible to take them all? These are the more important questions you should debate..

    • AJ

      From the sound of your post, you are clueless about the movement of refugees. Globally, there are over 50 million refugees worldwide. Where do you think they all go? Let me break it down for you. 10 countries in the world host about 12 million of these. Germany is a part of this list with about 600k. The only European country. Jordan has a 3:1 refugee ration. For Lebanon, that number is 4:1. In raw numbers, Pakistan has 2.6m refugees, Jordan has 2.4m, Turkey 1.8m, Lebanon 1.2m. Europe, however, is grappling with 0.8m. Spread over an entire continent. The richest continent on this planet.

      I’ll agree though that the Gulf countries, in particular, have not done their fair share. Not even close. But it’s about those countries specifically. Muslims have been catering to people made refugees by Western actions for the longest time. And those made refugees because of other Muslims.

      So, to answer your question “why only Europe is responsible to take them all”, it isn’t. Nor is it taking them all. But you are so completely consumed by your own self, you have become completely deaf, dumb and blind. That is not the more important question. It is completely irrelevant. And this is why it is not being debated rigorously, despite the efforts of racists.

    • paul 2

      how ignorant of you, don’t write crap before at least doing 10 mins research. 90% of the refugees are living in turkey, lebanon, iraq, egypt, jordan etc. forget saudi arabia they’ve banned refugees

    • grace

      Oh yeah, they might. Then kill us for being filthy infidels. Maybe put us in jail for drinking beer or kissing in public.

  28. Rocio RB

    They are people, like us, like european citizens. All people have to have opportunities in their life, without borders, without countries. Land don’t belong to government, or religion. People who defended this reason are crazy. World are crazy.

    • Danny T

      Who is trying to blow up the trains in London?
      Who is the reason why we have to take off our shoes at security in the airport?
      Whose Religion advocates murder of non believers?

    • EU reform- proactive

      ……confused? Why are “they” collectively known as “Arab citizens” and not “Europeans citizens”? Still longing to live like Homo erectus- as hunter/gatherers, foraging and pastoralists- without borders & property rights? Crazy for sure!

    • Elizabeth

      so are you

  29. Tsvetan Tsekov Steven

    As far as they r not imposing their religion to the host society and it doesnt hinders them to successfully integrate, I dont care if they r muslims or not. Othereise, it is a burdeon. For example: some muslim girls in Denmark refuse to take part in phisical education classes at school because of their burca or other head covers or it is not common for the muslim women to work,hence contribute to the host economy, but they must stay at home all life long and be housewives. Thus, its not the religion, it is tge socio-cultural differences ppl bring with them that do not work in a western environment….

  30. Massimo Ortale

    In case of a refugee asking and obtaining asylum, I think that religion, race or etnicity it doesn’t matter at all.

    • Ana

      I think its the first time in history that an ENTIRE COUNTRY asks for asylum. If 200 people ask asylum for political beliefs fair enough. If we are speaking about thousands of thousands though, who see the opportunity NOT to fight and go the easy way (aka live your dream in Europe), then is it the same?!! Do the maths…

  31. Eugenia Serban

    It s not religion or ethnicity, it s survival
    Europe can t fit inside it the milions of persecuted people in Africa and Asia
    Help must be oferred in their native countries, peace must be insured there,
    The invasion will not benefit to anybody

  32. Yousri Loussaif

    Europe is beyond religion etnicity. …
    We have the duty to protect these values. … no criteria Just screening for warcriminals..
    That Why I understatement Orban,but as humain hé is,the history his People have do play part in it… But.. hé is Right when hé demands bordercontrol. .to protect. …by Any means(biometric tags for example ).because Its a borderregion…wich is logical. .
    But refusing refugees or having quotas or criteria for helping is wrong..and does not consist with European Values..

  33. Mihæl

    If we leftists are against religion and we became much liberal than we used to be in history, why would we be house conservative, religious immigrants? Czech president Miloš Zeman is left and he used to be member of a communist party told he fears for his country, Croatian politician Mirela Holy who is ultra liberal (left liberals) also fears them and asks how many potential terrorist, Croatian MP Damir Kajolin also politically left asked why men do not fight for their own country and and wants to help only children and women. Why would we leftist who used to oppress religion let religious immigrants in? Most left fears hostillity on religion so many left-centre and leftists are against those religious refugees. Remember how many mosques were destroied in SSSR during Lenin and Stalin rule, China is not letting them wearing hijab and oppress them (read Amnesty International report about it), Angola is moving ahead in banning hateful religion entirely. Those are all left countries but left not left liberals like we have in EU but even they started to change oppinions. Why would secular, pro-prostitution, pro-gay rights activists support them in our country if most of them are bigots, dangerous to people because fairy tale Quran says so? They are far more conservative about certain issues than far-right MEPs in EU parliament but if someone criticizes them is all of the sudden far right?! Why would we let them if they are forcing that religion and do not respect us?
    Obedient people who will respect laws of the country they were housed in should be integrated and respected!
    For the end one little question: if you support minority rights like transgender people rights, why would you allow entering the country for those who will aim to kill them or if you just support drinking alcohol? Little irronical ain’t it?!

  34. ironworker

    Of course they are. One of the fundamental pillar of EU is religious tolerance.

    • EU reform- proactive

      ….???… yes, practiced and believed by pc Europeans- not Arab middle easterners!

  35. Matej Zaggy Zagorc

    I think all sides raise valid points. Well. Except the side purely controlled by fear. It should be carefully debated and consider all the factors. Not just scream YES or NO down the street

  36. Maia Alexandrova

    No, they are not wrong. Those countries are afraid of having to deal with Muslim values such as aggression, justified in the name of religion. Such values cannot be integrated into any European society. Islam approves violence and killing of non-Muslims, therefore it is a threat to the national security of all European countries. Currently two thirds of refugees are young men of fighting age. Why? Supposedly they were running from the war, why did they leave their familes behind at the hands of the terrorists? It doesn’t add up! How can we distinguish what kind of Muslims they are – moderate or radical? We don’t know who they are and what they intend to do after they settle. Some of them could be Islamic fanatics posing as refugees. Imagine – what if in 2-3 years’ time those refugees start revealing their true identity and we end up with a huge army from the Islamic State here, in Europe? How are our countries going to be protected when they have already let the enemy within and it is in too great numbers to be effectively overcome? This is why, my opinion is that if Muslim refugees are to be accepted, it should be only women, children and their husbands/fathers. Any single man over 18 should be sent back to fight against the Islamic State, not beg in Europe. For goodness sake, are the Kurdish women the only real men left in Iraq and Syria who are ready to fight the terrorists and protect their land, apart from the rest of the Kurdish army?

    • EU reform- proactive

      ………very valid points Maia!

    • Betha

      Agree 100%

  37. Giwrgos Filippatos

    This is a very complicated matter.In terms of religion every other people from Africa-Asia SOuth America would be allright.But islam has proved it has some isssues in terms of korani, each guy ”translates it” with his own way which is very dangerous.lets not forget what atrocities happen in the east currently with thousand of dead become in the name of a specific religion and specific beilefs nothing is random

  38. Max Berre

    This is a stupid question. Every generation people ask whether gays have rights, whether blacks have rights, whether women have rights, whether transgendered people have rights. It’s always the same answer.

    EVERYBODY HAS RIGHTS. STOP ASKING THIS BULLSHIT QUESTION.

    • Ana

      Remember this Max, when after a few years Muslims will bully the gay people in Belgium, will treat women as inferior class creatures and will terror your neighbourhood :) Fun times to come!

    • EU reform- proactive

      ……………a reminder: you forgot to mention “obligations & responsibilities”!

    • grace

      Slam dunk Ana. Women’s rights, gay rights, religious freedom, right to free speech. Hell, we won’t even have forums like this. Unless it’s to write Alla akbar.

    • Betha

      Nobody has rights. Rights are a result of societal values. They are often fought for, typically against ideologies like islam that would see them shattered and replaced by “rights” dictated by their own values. Values dictated by somebodies interpretation of the koran. An ancient text that was copied down from the ramblings of an illiterate, child raping, schizophrenic peasant in the middle east. Rights are not inherent in nature, they are established. A lesson that will soon be learned if we are not careful who we let into our countries. Just see what rights are left when Islamic State is established. Figurative bleeding hearts can very quickly turn literal if certain lines are not drawn. I will never be afraid of offending someone who follows an ideology that would have me beheaded. No, I hate people who believe they have the “RIGHT” to kill me. How about that right?

    • Ann

      Rights? What about responsibilities? Screaming about “my rights” without context is barbarian.

  39. Toni Muñiz

    Yes, we should have the right. As I see it, islam should be banned in the EU as it goes against all our values. Islam should not be seen as a religion, but a theocratic sect.

    • grace

      Islam enslaves its people, especially women, to its laws by punishing them severely if they don’t adhere. Islam is slavery.

  40. Weronika Natkaniec

    No, NOT. We have right to have preservation of identity in medium and long time period. WE ARE CHRISTIAN – AND ISLAM IS incompatible with Christianity!
    Muslims shun integration and do not respect the rights of the majority. We have examples of failed integration in the West Europe – look at suburbs in France, look at minority in Germany cieties (no go zones), and Austria, look at end of Sweden in Malmo. Please respect our right! People are afraid of the risk of a terrorism. In the West there is atheism. Here people believe that Jesus is the living God. His mother Maria is still the Queen of Poland – real Queen! Muslims offended him. SAY THAT WAS ONLY PROPHET – one of many. How can we tolerate? It is impossible. We do not impose anybody what to believe. But we will not allow it to insult us. Saying that God is not a God? We do not agree to lie to us, nor to offend. If you are coming to Poland. Respect our faith. Respect our tradition. Then live as you wish! This is Free country. Hardly anyone knows that. In Poland we have since the sixteenth century, the community of Muslim Tatars. It’s great and respected people. They are the real Polish Muslims.

  41. Thomas Riley

    Almost all of these Refugees are muslims, they come from a religion & culture that discriminates Christians, in their own countries the different groups are having problems living together, there is war, there is genocide, as a European I am not prepared to take the risk of our safe, free and prosperous European countries becoming like Lebanon,Syria etc., and I know the thought police will pounce on my comment, because I am not calling for taking up these strangers from a different culture, but you see, taking up these people is a short sighted position, what will happen in 20 years, 50 years or even 100 years, will future Generations grow up to regret the current policy of open doors to muslims, will there be a future Syria style Jihad War in Western Europe, I dont know, but we should not play lotto with our future.

    • grace

      Yes, Thomas. I believe we will pay dearly for our folly. Many want to play nice with the Muslims, but it is like ignorant sheep playing with wolves. They may look small, harmless and helpless now, but even the baby wolves will grow up to eat us and our children.
      We are a people who cry help thy neighbour and they are a people who believe in a religion that says kill the filthy infidel (us), and they chop off hands a d heads. How do you think it will end?

  42. Chris Panagis

    To accept a judgement we have to accept that someone has the right to judge. Countries do retain their sovereignty. The pop madness of indiscriminative tolerance will bring Europe to its knees. Not because one cast of immigrants or refugees or schtroumpfs or whatever is better than the other or something, but because Europe is falling apart, and needs to attain cohesion and solidarity. I do not fully understand the political games played now, but I know that nothing good is coming for the world the next years (Source: LLB Law, Politics, IQ ~ 170)

    • Ann

      Here here. DPhil Molecular Biology IQ 152

  43. Rüdiger Lohf

    It would be silly to force countries doing something that maybe does not suit to their society…

  44. Pierfrancesco De Felice

    Yes they are wrong absolutely. When nationalist spirit meets religious spirit there is the birth of discrimination. We are European, this means that we can be Catholic European, Muslim European, Buddhist European ecc. But everyone must respect the traditions and laws of the country where everyone lives in Europe.

    • Marc

      Pier I get your point, you dont like discrimination, you want to be a Idealist, fine, me too, but Islam has a serious problem with violence, there have already been numerous terrorist attacks in European countries, and many more failed terrorist attacks, nobody is saying that Muslims shouldnt come because of how they look, or what name they have, but they follow a religion that discriminates Christians in their own countries, how can something that doesnt work in their own countries work here?

    • James Campbell

      Your sentiments are fine but each nation need to forge its own consensus on the issue. As this debate shows, we are far from such consensus and branding opposition to your view as discrimination won’t win hearts and minds.

    • grace

      The Muslims discriminate against women, gays, Christians, Buddhists, Hindus.

  45. Paul Alleyne

    What makes this question even more interesting is to add the fact that their own muslim brothers like Dubai,Qatar etc. REFUSE to take up their own fellow muslims, think about that, these are the richest countries in the world, they build the tallest,biggest and most luxurious buildings etc., even whole Islands, they buy the most expensive cars, clothes and jewelry, but they outright REFUSE to take up their own muslim people, and you know why? because they fear terrorism, as if we Christians who they disparagingly call Kuffar would have nothing to fear from muslim terrorists, remember something called 7/7, or the Madrid Bombings or the Charlie Hebdo Massacre, and how about the over 2 dozen failed terrorist attacks, it is perfectly legitimate based on the negative experiences with Islam and Muslims to call for only Christian Refugees to be allowed in. I perfectly understand the implication, it would be looked at as racist, maybe it even is racist, but it would not be just so, it is a reaction to a real problem coming out of Islam, the problem of Islamic intolerance to Christians,Jews and in general anything that is not Muslim and especially not Sunni, and it would also be a reaction to the violence that comes from that intolerance. It is a human right to preserve your people and your nation, this is not about a white race or something like that (by the way Muslim girls are forbidden from marrying non muslims, so who is the Herrenmensch now?), this is about our way of life.How long do you think this way of life can be preserved if every poor man, woman and child, every refugee from war etc. gets up and on their way to Germany, France,UK and other obvioulsy western European countries, I say in 50 years its over, the party is over and we will suffer, our countries will become like the third world hellholes these people escaped from and we will all be worse of.My opinion, will not be popular, my opinion will be heavily critisized, but please dont get personal, make a good comment and proove with facts that I am wrong, Il gladly accept that I am wrong if you can proove it.

    • James Campbell

      Yes – refusal of rich Gulf states to accept refugees is unacceptable. The prospect of integration into another Islamic society is much more realistic. In practice, Muslim integration into the UK at least is very rare.

    • Ana

      The sad thing is that you are not wrong but no one can change the mind of your country’s leaders…For as long as they say “you are welcome” , problems will also be welcome!

    • George

      which the Syrian ISIS totally disregard…

  46. Peter Lovis

    The refugees need to be accepted and there is no questiong about it. We need to respect their religion and vice versa ! Most people are willing to co-exsist with another religion if there is mutual respect.
    There are always extremes, but don’t forget that Christianity also has extremists.

    • gabriel

      Viceversa is never going to happen. As for Christian extremists, I haven’t seen many muslims beheaded in the name of Christ lately.

    • AJ

      @Gabriel, not beheaded but certainly blasted. And shot. If you have not seen it, it’s because you choose not to see if or are blind. Surely you have not missed all the bombs raining down from the UAVs? Or the invasion and occupation of numerous Muslim countries? Or providing weapons to despots solely to allow the murder of Muslims?

      I hate to have to point this out but I do not think you can move past this ignorant position you have until you understand it is not about one religion being worse than the other. Precisely as Peter says, there are extremes on all sides. Most people do in fact co-exist in peace. I am sorry you are unable to see or comprehend that.

    • gabriel

      @AJ – you are either a cultural Marxist or an ISIS cheerleader.
      Those despots are that best thing which happened to Muslims – look what’s happening without them. In fact, Muslims themselves state that Islam and democracy are incompatible, there is no such thing as a Muslim democrat, whoever is a democrat is no Muslim (because they think their laws – the Sharia – are issued by God, so not by the people).
      People selling them weapons are not Christian extremists.
      Since decolonization, very few Muslim countries have been invaded by Christian nations. In fact, I can only think of Iraq and Afghanistan, and for Afghanistan I can hardly blame US after 9/11.
      My country spent more than 4 centuries under Muslim domination so I can hardly sympathize with this cultural Marxist b******t making Muslims victims. They are no victims, they used to plunder & conquer Europe from the Mediterranean & Atlantic coast all the way to the Urals, and that was not so long ago. My country only became independent from Ottomans in 1877 – that’s only 138 years ago.

    • Angie

      Peter I would like to believe they would respect the values that they have emigrated to however this doesn’t seem to be the case. There have many incidents here in Canada of some of them trying to push the components of sharia law. One male university refused to work with his female classmates based on his cultural belief. Unfortunately, for fear of being called a racist his claim was allowed. I see this as racism against the females and allowed because of our politically correct society.

  47. Philippa Dewar

    I really do not understand how this has become an issue. 1. These are refugees and should be taken in no matter what! 2. European states all claim to be secular so why is religion even an issue? 3. I understand that people are afraid of a religion that they do not know much about aside from what they have read in the media, but how many of the people of Europe are actually practising Christians? I think this is a non-issue being used to dodge our basic responisibilities to any people fleeing for their lives.

    • gabriel

      Thousands of them are ISIS terrorists infiltrated among civilians.

    • Ericbanner

      Phillippa,On the assumption that we they should be taken in no matter what,where are you proposing they all live,simple enough question ?
      As far as being a non issue,I see it as the main over riding issue,where does it say that we have to accept tens of thousands of people into our (often ) overcrowded countries,I frankly dont want that many people coming to the Britain ,and I dont much care what their religeon is.Some of those who come are fleeing for their lives, the problem is that they all seem mighty choosy about where they want to flee to ! i wouldnt have thought they would be quite so particular ,would you ?

    • Betha

      Naive. See how you feel when their rights trump yours. It’s Muslim rights and values or the rights and values of the free world. They cannot both be respected, they are mutually exclusive. Hypothetical for a simple mindset: If a country full of child sacrificing statnists were fleeing their country, want in to yours, but still want to practice a religion that sacrifices children? Still respect their rights? Well take a look at the Koran and you’ll find equally abhorrent laws and punishments. It is not unacceptable to disrespect people who would like to see you dead… And truly believe they have the right to kill you. Beheaded.

  48. Konstantin Zacharoudis

    The basic fact is that muslemic religion does not accept and sees as enemy any other religion. Also it dictates the life and habits to follow, p.e. you can not choose to not believe in the coran. In small and acceptable numbers it does not affect the hosting state but with birth-rates above 8, while average Europe has only 1,38 (2009) this meansd that, including the immigrants, very soon we will not talk about Europe any more. Please watch the video link below. Are we ready for that? Are the voices of YES ready to accept to hand over the government to muslemic majority and start living with new directives?(Burgha, Sharia, Food, Marriage etc, Democracy?) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6hESQ1-ZVo
    Even 2ond and 3rd generation who will live in a ghetto with their parets will be necesserily growing up by the same thoughts.

  49. Patricia Smith

    Of course asylum goes beyond the options cited but I can also understand countries that do not have a particular religious group or present facilities for their needs being concerned (whether I agree with them or not is irrelevant) as to how and if they have the ability to support those refugees. If their view is a hanger on from previous conflicts that is another matter entirely. Maybe turn it around and ask how many Muslim countries welcome Christians with open arms?

  50. Fani Stavridou

    yes the european member states must decide who will accept or not…. we must protect our christian identity

    • Marc

      Muslims come from a culture and religion that discriminates and persecutes christians in the countries where these muslims come from, so you shouldnt talk such foolishness Joanna.

    • George

      No, it’s not but our governments are secular and not religious so they don’t abide by Christian laws but they have to worry about things such as social cohesion and peace.

  51. Ferenc F. Rippel

    Hungary Doesn’t want any Asian African Muslims ! They are not for Europe not for hungary . No chance . They are only an invasion against the European white man civilization!

  52. Taline Babikian Angelidou

    As I wrote on another page, I will quote here again what it was “Taline Babikian Angelidou Gulf countries should also be held responsible, in my opinion more than the EU. The innocent people can have some kind of refuge in Europe…but ultimately, in the long run, they should return to their homeland or within the neighboring countries as their culture is almost the same. I am saying this for their benefit in the long run…EU can not in the long run absorb more in my humble opinion though they can help UNICEF or any other institute by supporting their needs, be it the red cross or red crescent..it is so sad to see lives lost at sea…all the result of war conflict provoked by both East and West policies:(

  53. Debby Teusink

    People are people. I am not christian, but humanist. It is not a specific religion that is wrong, all religions are wrong.

    • Marc

      Debby there you go again making nonsensical comparisons, tell me who is trying to blow up airplanes?, who wants to kill writers, cartoonists etc?, who has an ambition to impose religious laws on other people?
      Islam has a very big problem with violence, its a fact.

    • Molly

      Does sharia law promote the humanist point of view? When it does then so will I.

    • grace

      “People are people”. Na aa. There are people who would never hurt a fly and people who will butcher others, enjoy doing so and film it. There is a WORLD of difference between people.

    • Steven

      Even if it means that your own country becomes a unsafe place?

    • gabriel

      Don’t worry, Florin, they’ll be there to explain everybody that not all Muslims are terrorists, that in fact Muslims are as horrified as we are of those criminal acts, etc.

  54. gabriel

    Yes, only non-muslim (not necessarily Christian) should be accepted because they are part of religious minorities facing genocide in the Middle East. As for the rest they can find shelter in neighboring muslim nations.

    • George

      Absolutely agree with this comment.

    • Betha

      Agreed.

  55. EU reform- proactive

    Slovakia & others- not bordering or not being the closest to the war- are RIGHT & the EU wrong!

    And yes, asylum goes beyond religion, race, and ethnicity! But, it still should be these country’s free & sovereign choices- without interference. If not, than “something is rotten in the state of Denmark”

    The UN/EU rules are clear, were adhered to by Hungary- as best it could- but the overall chaotic middle east exodus was/is TOTALLY mismanaged by the EU/UN. The EC fingers being pointed in the wrong direction- “mea culpa”!

    After Germany agreed & decided to accept ~800k asylum seekers (or future “immigrants”?), it should have collected them directly from Turkey, Jordan or Lebanon etc and transported them safely to Germany by land or air- saving hardships & sparing everybody their “moral” pc lecture! Should they want more such “seekers”- surely they are free to negotiate & organize that properly!

    After the Ottoman Empire made Europe and Christianity shiver in fear and turned the Balkan into Vassal states- (paying the sultan annual tributes of thousands of ducats)- one must understand & allow these EU member states freedom in their choices! Today, our taxes are used to pay tributes once more, to a new version of the Suleiman ‘the Magnificent’.

    Dictatorial utterances (to IMPOSE quotas) by France etc- having caused past disunity 16th century Europe, by helping the Turks to attack Europe & the defending Habsburgers- should be a reminder & warning of similarities in history.

  56. Barbara Galea-Haji

    While some of the respective countries were under communist regimes, their attitude about their christian traditions was not so strong, I remember. Perhaps in the future,i.e. a more atheist perspective can gain grounds where today the majority is religious. My opinion: new citizens must only firmly abide to the laws of the protecting state/ the EU.

    • Ann

      I am an atheist, so whichever fairy tale you believe in, basically that’s fine by me. But when you want to cover me head to toe, take away my right to speak, write it in law that my husband can beat me, and value me less than you goats, I get a bit uppity and say I disagree with it. Not because of who you worship but because of the society you force onto everyone.

  57. Anargyros Botsis

    Muslims will overgrow the local population in many Christian Countries pretty soon. In some Countries it is strongly stated in the Constitution that the Official Religion of the Country is Christianity ( ie 90+% of the people MUST BE Christians ). A statement, above all European and International Law that can NEVER be Amended. ( In Greece the National Constitution in much Stronger – Legally speaking – and its provisions are being In – forced under all circumstances, even when European or International Laws state otherwise …)

  58. Andreia Fonseca

    although we know of the dangers related with ISIS agents among refugees. that permiss is wrong. race gender and religion should not account for the decision of accepting refugeees. this is not the question. the question why european companies are still being allowed to sell guns and arming this conflict?

  59. Andries Vienne

    Under the Geneva Convention they are not allowed to discriminate on any grounds. So yes, they’re wrong!

    • Steven

      The geneva convention doesnt address this for asylum, and even if, the rights of the host nations come first, we need to think about the demographics, a Islamized Sweden,France etc. is not good for our future, it will mean more Islam and less freedom, and certainly more terrorism.

    • Kate Calder

      The problem isn’t the islamicisation of countries. The problem is the idea that one’s country should have some bearing on what religion one follows.

      Religion is a private matter and should not be any business of the state.

      Anyone concerned about the potential damage to our freedoms from Islam should look carefully at the extremes of Christianity in the USA, where they will hopefully see that even a more familiar religion can be twisted almost into its own direct opposite in order to serve a political agenda. Islam isn’t immune to this, and nor is any other faith (and nor, for that matter, is atheism).

      A country that declares itself Christian bears careful watching, just as does any that calls itself Muslim.

    • grace

      So do the Islamic states have a similar vonvention that forbids them from beheading journalists.

    • EU reform- proactive

      …think again! Could be another (different) time bomb in 1 or 2 decades. Border controls will become a necessity due to “Schengen’s insecurity”! Its design reason & design life has changed & expired! The “designers” did not notice yet- unfortunately!

  60. Mike Oxlittle

    Well having had the awful experience of visiting Poland myself,I can only say that it’s more likely that the Syrians will refuse to go there.I don’t believe they’re quite that desperate.Still has sovereign nations it’s their perfect right to admit or bar anyone they like.

  61. Manjinder S Chauhan

    Well for the sake of humanity and asylum principles yes it is not relevant what religion one follows. But if I think logically , somehow it will require great level of effort from Muslims asylum seekers to prove that they are ready to coexist peaceful accepting the European way of living. If the continue to preach what they been practicing in there countries then I’m sorry to say Europe will be doomed in no time.

    • EU reform- proactive

      ……. and why not any of the Arab league states first- who didn’t move a finger or $ yet?

  62. Małgorzata Prześlak

    At the beginning they have to respect our law and stop destroy our goods. They can also go to Asia it’s not only EU.

  63. Eduardo Branco

    EU Member States have the right to decide they do not want ‘a large number of Muslim people’.

  64. Rui Correia

    Food for thought:
    1st- YOU tell me “Debate Europe” :-)
    Or even better: go and ask those guys who had all those eastern enlargement ideas… they should know who they were inviting in, right?
    So, what’s new? What’s the big surprise now??
    2nd- of course, it’s silly to force any society to accept anything, or to do something…
    Afterall, are we free to choose who do we share our territory with? Or not?
    Most politicians (EU-rocrats included) don’t live in the real world, I believe some would go crazy having to share streets and common areas with some people ;-)

  65. gabriel

    Something I missed before in my comments: the picture which is the image of this debate is all wrong. I understand this website is more or less a civil society – operated platform.
    Is civil society in Europe resorting to misinformation and manipulation? That is a nice propaganda image.
    The crying child is clearly intended to appeal to our emotions – such images of children seldom fail to move normal people. But look at the mother’s expression: indifferent.
    Instead of taking care of whatever is bothering the little one, she displays that banner. How about it for a commercial? A slogan, a child crying at the right time in the right place … Open the borders for our children, right?
    As a mother, with that child crying like that, she should be attending to the child’s needs instead of posing with that slogan.
    Nothing here about that guy in Budapest who makes the cut-throat sign.

    • grace

      Gabriel, the media and the immigrants have been guilty of milking images of children and of using children for their own agenda. For example, the children who got in the way of tear gas and water spray on Hungary’s border. When you see a barricade of police wearing shields and armed with tea gas and water spray, why the hell would you put your kids ANYWHERE NEAR that. It is as though they want the kids to get hurt and distressed so that the media can get a good shot and they can gain sympathy. And if a child is distressed, what parent would raise them up and distress them even more by waving them at the press. It seems like the immigrants even want their kids worked up and distressed, rather than to be to be protected.

      I also want to ask, has anyone else heard or confirmed news on the poor little drowned boy; the poster child for refugees. Is it true that his family had come not from Syria, but had been living and working in Turkey for 3 years, and that the father took the family to Europe because he wanted dental work, and that he lied to the media. Now people might say, but a drowned child is still a tradgedy, and it certainly is, but it’s not OK for the media to be printing everything without validating it. Since children are only a small percentage of the immigrants, why are they in the greater percentage of the photos. It’s not honest journalism.

    • Kate Calder

      “Think of the children” is one of the most basic flawed arguments out there, and I’d be very surprised if it isn’t in plentiful supply in discussions on this site.

      It’s certainly popular amongst lobbyists and politicians, along with its implied connotation: if you don’t agree with me, you hate children!

      And the great thing is, it doesn’t have any inherent meaning, so it can be used by both sides of any argument. As here, where it’s used to support the refugees (their poor kids are suffering, let them in) and to rebuke them (they should be tending to their poor kids instead of posing for pictures; they’re to blame for putting their poor kids in front of water cannon).

  66. Rui Duarte

    Of course they do. Europe should not be used to IMPOSE the views of some member-states on other member-states.

  67. Rui Duarte

    Of course they do. Europe should not be used to IMPOSE the views of some member-states on other member-states.

  68. Rui Duarte

    Chistians (and some religious minorities) are being wiped-out from the middle east. We have a duty to protect them.

  69. Neal Caffrey

    They are completely right to welcome only Christian. Why countries from the Gulf are not welcoming people from their religion? The burden should be at least shared…The ones already in Europe brought enough problems without having more…

  70. Shahrooz Haghighi

    Muslems are very dangers for Europe and they will make lot of problems for the european residences, European countries must stop them to come to this countries

  71. Irena Leibovici

    the EU citizens have the rights to decide that they do not want to be covered by the Muslims in their own countries -clean, with high standard of life! The Christian are killed by those Muslims in their countries, why are they come to Christian majority countries? TO DESTROY! Help the children, their mothers and fathers, but the other, send them back! If you will put them to work, most of them will go alone!

  72. Célia Grimaneza

    I think it’s not a question of religion, it’s a matter of who are we letting in, are their purposes real, are they running from misery and war or they have something else in mind? A human life matters more than a religious belief or a skin color, but honestly, let’s help first those in need in our country then we can help all the others!

  73. Nikolaos Sotirelis

    OPEN THE BORDERS!!! After all, all this humanitarian crisis caused by West!
    Europe has armed and financed IS. It still has the blood of innocent people on its hands

  74. Sabin Popescu

    That sign should be written in Arabic, because most rich arab states won’t take any refugee…

  75. Amélia Costa-Pereira

    It is risky with muslims, but we can not assume they are all radicals.

    It is, however, important to know how to deal with them and their reactions.
    It is important to let them know we have rules and they have to adjust to those rules.

    Either they accept them or they have a choice to leave. I think it is fair. But they are not being educated .

    Intervention in situations like this one have to be swift and with determination.
    https://www.facebook.com/298195193543350/videos/1132004840162377/?pnref=story

  76. Kate Calder

    It’s absolutely wrong to demand only Christian refugees, or those of any other specified religion.

    The idea that any country in Europe in 2015 considers itself a ‘Christian country’ is worrying in itself. I say this as someone who is very much in favour of freedom of religion and generally quite positive about the beneficial effects religion can have.

    But there shouldn’t be ‘Christian countries’ any more. That’s not an idea that’s going to contribute to a harmonious world.

    • EU reform- proactive

      To support- consciously or not- the aim to create & clone a new future European serf “, designed according some sinister and elitists pattern- be it through reckless pan-European-ism by integrating Europe by hook (force) and by crook (undemocratic-ally) is unwise!
      Further, the deletion of: individualism, family values, national traditions & cultures, and established norms & believe systems of the present society- will quicken the demise of a Europe- which it does not deserve- & if, such dramatic deviation needs to be put to the test by referendums in each country FIRST!

    • Kate Calder

      Nobody’s talking about deleting cultures. I’m concerned that your country shouldn’t dictate what your religion should be. Nor should you expect your religion have any say bearing on how your country conducts itself.

      Follow what religion you like, by all means – but keep it out of politics, because in the end the only person your faith is relevant to is you.

    • EU reform- proactive

      Kate, the principle of separation of church and state or the varying degrees of “friendly” and “hostile” separations of church and state around Europe is clearly understood & accepted. If overly concerned please consult & expand some energies to change your British state/church relationship first, before advising the rest of Europe- acknowledged & counted as one opinion- as is mine.

      You’re vigorous canvassing is appreciated but should rather be directed- and the gospel of the elimination of religion or its hostile separation- lectured to the many Arab/Muslim & Islamic Republics- who still practice Sharia. Those governments are dictating religion; their preschool children have to attend the Madras’s and need to know the holy Qumran in Arabic by heart. This is understood, tolerated & accepted by Europeans- as their choice. However, their choice need never ever become our choice by dictate!

      Constitutionally, in all sovereign European states, the LAW still emanates from the PEOPLE and should not be dictated and re-written by the EC- by sinister means or pretending THEY know better! Religion is only part of the broader term known as Christian culture in Europe & cannot be argued or wished away- despite derogatory attempts! Remove Religion from culture- you undermine its whole culture!

      Culture (not religion) is the European identity and the accumulation of knowledge through a long struggle by their ancestors, defined by everything from language, religion, social habits, traditions, science, foods, poetry, music, free spirit, happiness, arts, adventurism, innovations, explorations, discovery’s- unlimited!

      Modern globalists who easily sell their present cultural identity or citizenship remain around a ~25% minority- good luck!

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Europe

    • George

      So should we remove the cross from our flags as well, Kate? Regardless of religion, social cohesion is necessary and that is being put at risk by admitting so many Muslims into Europe. I think that those countries are absolutely right and they are speaking what most are thinking but are too timid to express. It wouldn’t be PC correct, you see…

    • Kate Calder

      “So should we remove the cross from our flags as well, Kate?”

      If it were up to me, there would be no national flags, because we – as humanity – would’ve grown up, got over ourselves and abandoned the damaging and backwards idea of nations.

      Since that’s not going to happen any time soon, because we all love our tiny, parochial way of looking at the world, then I don’t see that ‘a cross’ is particularly relevant. A cross on a flag might’ve meant ‘Christian’ once. Now it’s just a cross.

      “Regardless of religion, social cohesion is necessary and that is being put at risk by admitting so many Muslims into Europe. I think that those countries are absolutely right and they are speaking what most are thinking but are too timid to express. It wouldn’t be PC correct, you see…”

      Ah, yes: terrible, evil old ‘PC’ – the go-to reason to dismiss every issue, every matter of equality, every concern about human rights. Just frame it as ‘PC gone mad’, or whatever the favourite Daily Mail-esque phrase of the day might be, and you don’t have to concern yourself with the fact that, Christian or Muslim, these are *human beings* fleeing conflict and fear and danger, just like I’d be if it were happening here, and just as I strongly suspect you would be as well. But we can’t muster up a scrap of empathy for them because they went and said their prayers to… oh. To the same God as Europe’s, as it turns out.

    • George

      Kate, you are an ignorant woman.

    • George

      It’s not about an idea, Kate. It’s about our history and culture but that’s not necessarily something you know about, since you seem to have lived all your life on an island cut off from where it all happened…

    • Kate Calder

      History and culture are fine in their place, but they shouldn’t be a prison or a millstone. Keep them when they’re beneficial; be prepared to stop clinging to them if theirs stopping us progressing.

      And if they’re supporting barriers between human beings, then I say it’s time to put them aside and concentrate on what we want to be, rather than being tethered to what we have been.

    • Kate Calder

      @George: Yup – although I’d quibble with ‘confessed’. ‘Confessed’ implies an admission of guilt. I’m simply telling you I’m a druid. Well, neo-druid, of course, if you want to be technical about it. Reconstructionist druid if you don’t mind the typing involved.

      You can also check the Daily Mail if you’re interested in finding out what utter loonies we are.

      But that aside, George – if you noticed that post then you noticed the question I asked. ‘TrueEuropean’ doesn’t seem to have had an answer for it. Since you also appear to advocate ‘social cohesion’ by excluding religions you don’t approve of, I could reasonably ask you the same question I asked TrueEuropean. What’s your answer? As a druid who’s a Brit born to Brits born to Brits, where should I go to preserve your monoculture Europe?

    • George

      Kate, you really have no understanding of the subject under discussion here. You’re just looking for a platform to promote your irrelevant views. You’re wasting people’s time…

    • Ann

      Your argument assumes Islam is just a religion. Have you read to Quran, the Hadiths or the Sura? They are more than just a bit political. My objection is their politics, not what brand of supernatural being they worship.

  77. Carolina Muro Rosa

    How can European women feel safe in an environment with a lot of people from one outside culture that treats women as inferior?! I find highly offensive to see women covered like they do. Just as they would feel offensive if we were to go to their streets with open shoulders, short dresses and so on. When in Rome…

  78. Mika Ainasoja

    There is no tolerance for discrimination based on race, gender, religion etc. This is the European principle!

    • Ann

      What about politics, should we tolerate National Socialism AKA Nazism?

  79. Taline Babikian Angelidou

    Like it happened in Canada, Canadian Muslims in one of the states (I do not remember which) who moved to Canada, either as refugee or immigrants through the years, requested that pork be removed from public schools menu. I do not know what happened at the end, but saying this, in an Arab country with a request like not covering your head or wearing shorts in high temperatures you will get a response such as this ‘ this is our rule, our custom and our way of life; if you do not like it, you can go back’ ! Having said that, I do not intend to insult anyone, just that you should accept the life style of the country you wanted to live in, like every one for work opportunities or life changes if they have moved to Emirates or KSA or Qatar etc..they live based on the rules/regulations of the country they are in. Foreigners who live in Middle East or Gulf hardly every want to change rules to suit them..but it is not the same for others in general who live in EU or any non Arabic country whose culture and life style is completely different.

  80. catherine benning

    No they are not wrong. They have seen the outcome of mass Muslim migration to other states and it is not something they want to embrace or have the cost that it will entail. Which is a phenominal amout. The policing of their lifestyle is costing the UK a fortune. FGM, the changes expected in schooling, medical adjustment, social cohesion, prisons, polygamy, rape and on and on.

    Also, there is the very real and growing problem of terrorism and the protection of the Christian and Jewish populations. Which is growing by the day. Tghis religion creates chaos in a secular or Chrisitian society. And those states who are rejecting it are standing by the citizens of their own countries as the first duty. Which is what all European states should be doing.

    People who come to Europe must be expected to adhere to the laws and social life of the host culture, and should that be unacceptable to their beliefs and desires, then they must choose to find refuge in Islamic states.

    Israel is now closing down Christian schools and wanting to remove the ethos of acceptance from their laws, why is that any different from those European states who feel they do not want to give up the social comfort they find in their chosen cultural expectations?

  81. Xavier Schoumaker

    Christianity is a myth based on other myths and written by unknown sources. It has pleased monarchs as a narrative to rule, and that is the only reason such pathetic myths still exist today, as ignorance is still widespread.

    • EU reform- proactive

      It is unwise to publish YOUR (personal) narrative by denouncing values & ethics incorporated in any (religious) philosophy as myth. You are however entitled to live your last day as an empty soul- religious, ignorant or not!

    • catherine benning

      @ Xavier Schoumaker

      And what is Judaism, Islam, Hindu, Shinto, Budhism and so on? Are you trying to tell us all that there is no human need for spiritual outlet. Because if you are you are not thinking broadly. Leave a void for this obvious need and it will be filled by something you will not like.

      Be careful what you wish for.

  82. Telma Coutinho

    Well, we shouldn’t select anyone because of their religion. But we should take several precautions. First of all this is a world problem not only european, so everyone should participate. Second, they should be registered. Third, we can only receive some, not all, we dont have the capacity to receive them all here, it would create caos and destroy things for both them and us, the point is, how will you select? Which criteria will we use?

  83. Kishan Bhatt

    Some of you need therapy. I’m happy to pay to stop you from generalising and catastrophizing what you interpret in the media.

    • catherine benning

      @ Kisham Bhatt:

      Why don’t you help all of us out of this wrong thinking by putting up some alternative attitudes on how we are wrong. And of course add some back up for your different views.

      It would be wonderful if we were able to prove what we see in our media, on these matters, are wrong. In fact, much of it, like Rotheram and the child rapes was hidden for years, those who knew of it were afraid to offend. As was FGM. It turns out there are thousands of girls in my country who have suffered this, after having been born here in Europe, than the hundred or so journalist tried to tell us it was. Likewise with honour killing, which remains in the dark to this day.

      Please, do give us some hope that our media has it very wrong, because if that cannot be shown, then it is those who believe it is not so that needs therapy.

  84. Mateusz Wilczyński

    Not at all. It’s the best case scenario for aiding refugees (more so migrants) while still managing to keep a level of cultural order. There will be less unrest as opposed to bringing in Muslims which would definitely clash with the Christian cultures of these specific nations.

  85. Vicente Silva Tavares

    Do these Syrian refugees sign a declaration that they will respect the laws of the countries of shelter? Most Muslims in Europe say Sharia is more important than the laws of the country the live in. Do these Muslims accept without reserve democracy, freedom of speech, right of changing of religion, gender equality? I don’t think so. They will try to change Europe into their own world they are running away. Europe is doomed.

    • gabriel

      How could we ask them to respect the law? That’s against their religion!

    • Kate Calder

      In America, a county clerk has recently been jailed for refusing to carry out the duties of the office to which she’s been elected, because she believes those duties are against her religion.

      They aren’t, of course. They’re against her own personal tastes and her particular political outlook. But rather than resign, and seek a job she feels able to do, it suits her – knowingly or not – to exploit the religion she claims to follow as a justification for her refusal to respect the law of the land.

      That is what a Christian can do. There are many more Christians like her. And there are many Muslims who do the same with their own claimed faith.

      But ‘many’ does not mean ‘most’. It is unjust to assign guilt to every Muslim based on your perception of those who use it to justify their own faults – just as it would be unfair to tar every Christian with the brush of that one clerk, and the others who do as she does.

    • gabriel

      @Kate Calder – the Muslims (and in their case “many” does mean “most”) would have killed the homosexuals instead of refusing to marry them and go to jail. According to Sharia which is the only law their religions allows them to recognize, homosexuals are killed.
      So stop whining about the horrific intolerance of that Christian clerk, because in a Muslim society homosexuals would be facing a far grimmer fate than being denied marriage.

    • Kate Calder

      And again we’re back to the same old argument: ‘Muslim countries’ show intolerance so we should be intolerant to Muslims.

      But hey: who says humanity needs to improve? Who says we need to strive to be better? As long as we get to say that someone else was wrong first…

    • Ethan

      to Kate Calder: “humanity needs to improve” is such a trite phrase. of course humanity needs to improve. You know a good way for that to happen? Stop Shariah from spreading.

  86. Alex Borg

    Absolutely, right of asylum should go beyond religion, race and ethnicity! But this should come accompanied by the asylum seekers’ duty to respect long acquired rights such as freedom of expression, total respect for women’s right of self-expression (in spite of their religion, no headscarves, burkas, etc.), right for sexual orientation, freedom of expression, etc. These rights should be spelt out as an essential condition before they acknowledge their status as EU citizens. These should be embedded in language courses, orientation sessions, etc.

  87. George

    They’re not wrong. Everyone should do the same.

    Can I reverse the question and ask why so many Muslims are coming to claim asylum in Europe and don’t claim this in other Muslim countries?

    They should be offered the option of converting.

    • Kate Calder

      It may be that you’re not aware of what’s happening in the region these people are fleeing, in which case I would urge you to find out more. You should perhaps be cautious of UK newspaper websites, which are more geared towards sales than the accurate reporting of news and whose content is often skewed in an attempt to appeal to a particular target audience.

      But you could consider visiting the EU or UN sites, or those of individual national governments.

      Unfortunately it’s not as straightforward as people from “Muslim countries” trying to get to Europe. It’s perhaps more accurate to say these are *people* – that is, human beings – who are fleeing an area of intense conflict and instability towards the nearest safe and stable region.

      Many of them will, of course, be Muslim, and will no doubt be hoping to find refuge in a country that will recognise not only their humanity but also their cultural and spiritual identity.

      Europe, of course, doesn’t require its citizens or its visitors to ‘convert’ to any particular religion because Europe doesn’t demand obedience to any particular faith – and a good thing, too, or I, a native Brit and pagan, wouldn’t be allowed to practise my own religion here, and my several friends who are atheists would have to leave.

    • George

      Kate, I am in Greece at the moment and I have been hearing the news from Greek news channels when I could be bothered to. What I post here is my opinion and not that of someone else. My great grandparents came to Greece as refugees from what is nowadays Turkey. They were deemed unwanted by the Young Turks’ new state because it was meant to be for Muslims. You will appreciate that Islam came to the area in the 15th century with the Turks and my great grandparents lived in a Thracian village that existed since prehistoric times. They went to Greece following their expulsion from Turkey and an agreement by the Greek government. The Greek government accepted them and arranged for them to be welcome in Greece because of their cultural identity which included religion. They didn’t pick where they would go. They were even told where in Greece to settle. They didn’t pick to go anywhere completely different to their own culture and then start complaining and criticising it, chop heads off and blow themselves up on trains. I hope you can work this out for yourself.

    • Kate Calder

      Not really, no.

      If I work through the references to things that happened three generations back, or in the 15th Century, what you appear to be saying is that because of those things refugees/migrants are basically going to try and blow people up. Is that right?

      You also talk about how they should be “offered the option of converting”. To what should we be demanding they convert before we allow them in?

  88. Jokera Jokerov

    Of course they do! It is their country and their responsibility. Half of Europe has horryfying memories about cohabitation with Muslims.

    • gabriel

      That is true! Cultural Marxists in the West are striving to instill and fuel a sense of guilt because for colonialism, but European colonization of Muslim territory has been much shorter than Muslim occupation of European territory. I have no such sense of guilt since my country never colonized but it has been under Ottoman rule for more than 4 centuries, just as Hungary and all Balkan nations. Russian and Ukraine have know the Tatar yoke – Muslim. Spain and Sicily also had been occupied by Muslims for a long time. They terrorized and plundered Europe from the Mediterranean and Atlantic coast all the way to the Urals, only Northern Europe got away. France, Austria, Poland got away because they have beaten them, not because Muslims spared them.
      So Europe should shed that sense of guilt as there is no reason for it, not to the Muslims.

  89. catherine benning

    @ |Kate Calder:

    As you clearly feel so strongly that the UK media has it wrong, and that what we see with our own eyes is tainted, I feel you would help us all if you put up some viewing back up and links to prove the biased papers and media are speaking with a forked tongue. Funny those media outlets that tell us how wonderful this is for us all never show us the people lined up in the post offices collecting welfare benefit in the cities.

    You are obviously extremely articulate and capable of finding the alternative view to show us all how wrong the stance you disbelieve is. Show us the areas where settled migrants are open and welcoming to the host culture and people of that culture. Show the local schools that are advantageous to ‘our’ children, rather then detrimental to their education examples we persistently are having pushed down out throats. Show the districts and people of immigrant communities and areas that are fighting against child rape by large section of their men and have taken those same men in their streets to task over what they have done. Show the wives, mothers and sisters of the jailed men calling for restaint and decency toward these little girls they raped in the thousands and endlessly. Please show me.

    Show us where they swim in the local pools with other individuals in the area rather than having them closed to the local indiginous people of their community when they are using them as a privilege. Where other females can’t use them as the immigrant females the area are considered too evil to join in with and they therefore must have the privilege we pay to make possible.

    Show us all the wonderful mosques that are opening their doors to the people of our countries who took them in. Show us the men coming forward telling us that female genital mutilation is an abuse against the women, as is honour killing, being covered from head to toe from childhood and having to submit to a law called Sharia that is not part of a European culture.

    If, as you write, the reporting in the UK is exceptionally wrong, show us where it is false and expose them for their lies. You can add links surely, and you can find migrant generosity toward those not of their faith easily if all we hear is blatant lies. You can certainly show their societal change toward women, like turning their backs against misogyny and polygamy that would be so easily provable. Which would help us to see the truth the way you do. It doesn’t take long when the grape vine should be full of it.

    Where did you gain the knowledge for your truth. You could show us the way. Or, is it you cannot be bothered to put effort into your crusade.

    • Kate Calder

      Well, we could play that game all day. I post a link to, say, an article i in the Guardian saying migrants are all saints and hard-done-to and we’re all monsters for not accepting them all unquestioningly. You post an article from the Daily Mail explaining why migrants are all shifty criminal scumbags just coming over here to exploit our NHS, convert us all to hard-line Islam, and blow up everyone who tries to celebrate Christmas.

      And back and forth it goes until everyone gets bored and no-one is convinced of anything.

      What about this instead: try looking at the reports from the UN, the EU, the Red Cross – the agencies that’re dealing with the issue and having to actually address the causes and the motivations of the people moving.

      Try going to http://www.un.org and http://www.unhcr.org; to http://ec.europa.eu/priorities/migration/index_en.htm; or to http://www.redcross.eu/en/News-Events/NEWS-ROOM/Migration-in-Western-Balkans-Red-Cross-response/.

      These are all agencies that are having to deal with the humans involved in this situation. I’m sure there are plenty more resources available if you’re interested.

      If you don’t want to do that, just consider how much actual logic there can be in ascribing a single morality and a single motivation to such a mass of humans – and how just you’d think it if someone wrote you off on the basis of the worst people to be found in your country.

  90. Jorige

    The irony here… Eastern Europe is full of social and economic instability, people are leaving their countries of birth for the West because they can’t afford to live a decent, stable life there, yet EU will give free money to refugees* and help them to settle in those countries.
    *technically they are only refugees once they reach the first country free of wars, if they decide to leave that country they are no longer refugees but economic migrants.

    Furthermore, no country in EE wants to have a Babylon on their doorstep. We are not ready for that, nor culturally nor economically. Religion is only an excuse.

    • Adrian Limbidis

      EXACTLY !
      EGG-***ING – ZACKTLY !

      Eastern Europeans can fill the shoes of these refugees if Germany needs workers.
      Nope, they rather take these people in.

      Even though they come in ILLEGALY.
      Even though they ADMIT they come for benefits not to work.

      The west is STUPID.

    • Kate Calder

      “[T]echnically they are only refugees once they reach the first country free of wars, if they decide to leave that country they are no longer refugees but economic migrants.”

      And don’t we love throwing that definition around? “It’s all down to money! They just want to take our jobs and our women!”

      Trouble is, ‘technically’ the definition given here is balderdash.

      An asylum seeker is – surprise! – someone who hopes to claim asylum in a country. If that country is the UK then an asylum seeker is someone who’s arrived here and made an asylum claim. Note that according to British law such a claim has to be made *from here*.

      If a person’s claim of asylum in Britain is accepted, *then* they become a refugee.

      Jorige implies there’s a simple point at which a justifiable prospective asylum claim becomes a fraudulent attempt to game the system.

      The term ‘economic migrant’ is being widely used in this debate by people not burdened with any actual responsibility for the situation. What you might call armchair immigration officers. Obviously, they have it easy, because unlike in the real world, they’re not having to make decisions about people’s lives and security. They’re able to make their judgements based purely on whether, for example, they think the people concerned look a bit shifty, or whether they in fact care a damn about those people’s lives and security.

      In the real world, EU governments are trying to find ways of processing the claims quickly, to sort out the real from the not-real, and, between them, to work out how to distribute the claims throughout the Union in order to minimise the imbalance.

      The difficulty is when someone, like Jorige here, implies that there’s a simple line to be drawn between one group of people and the other. If there were such a simple way of judging claims, I’ve no doubt it would make governments’ work a lot easier, but unfortunately (or perhaps fortunately, if you’re interested in actually doing the job right), there isn’t.

  91. Jaskaran

    Look at Muslims’ past exploitation, Barbaric present or Sharia based yearning of future. I don’t think they even have a conception of peaceful intermingling. If you feel Europe’s enlightenment values will somehow change them, just look at what is happening in East London. Charlie Hebdo killings are the only ones that got press out of hundreds of misadventures occurring across France. Even in India, look at the names of perpetrators of any major rape case. You will know.
    Europe still has time to get its act together. Once their population bomb starts ticking, there is no walking back.

  92. gabriel

    Look, a crane collapsed over their Grand Mosque in Mecca. Do you think Allah Himself is telling salafists their ways are wrong? I think anyone who believes in God (or Allah) should think about it.

    • Kate Calder

      I think it probably means a crane fell down. I’ve heard of a few churches catching fire or having bits drop off them and such. I don’t hear much talk attributing those things to a vengeful god.

    • EU reform- proactive

      Aghh Gabriel, you could have said something smarter! That is really dumb- sorry!

    • gabriel

      @Kate Calder & EU Reform-Proactive

      This happened to Islam’s holiest shrine, if I’m not mistaken, a few days before the Hajj and at this time of crisis. I understand you are not religious.
      But even to moderate Muslims, everything that happens, happens by Allah’s will. Including the crane falling down on that mosque. Especially given that it was caused by the elements – wind & rain as I understand.
      Muslims live & kill today by laws issued by Allah himself (Sharia).
      So to a true believer this incident should mean something, otherwise his faith is bullshit.
      For instance, one pious Saudi might think that they made Allah angry by not helping refugees.

    • consolacion barcenas

      What made it doubly strange is that it happened on the eve of 9/11, a lightning hit the crane causing it to fall. Just when they were shouting Death to the Great Satan.

    • EU reform- proactive

      I suppose you’re entitled to your opinion, especially since you admit to be superstitious- but be careful if a black cat crosses your path! Hasten to seek relief in witchcraft, black magic and sorcery!

      Since you chose to substitute knowledge for superstition and confuse “Divine intervention” with “force majeure”- being an insurable risk in today’s global economy- than science & the insurance industry needs to do more marketing.

      What’s best to do after such a freak & unfortunate construction accident is, to send condolences to all fatal victims families and wish all badly insured workers a speedy recovery- & hope that the responsible construction company has enough insurance cover to pay for all damages in a fair manner!

    • EU reform- proactive

      @proactice- laughing about myself!

      …….”SCNR”! Sometimes you notice too late that it is double trouble if an “under insured” worker is seriously “injured”. But if we modern people have to get used to NetLingo- we have to overcome a “SOHF” as well!

  93. Joy Kilcollum

    I really, don’t understand or comprehend why Individuals are unfairly, criticizing Slovakia;s statement regarding taking in of Syria’s refugees when he spoke the truth ? There are no Mosques within his country!. There are other countries that could participate since obvious distance has not been an obstacle if USA offening tto participate and take in refuguees Why not criticize Japan who in 2014 only will take in 11 out of the 5000 candidates and the discussion of the 11 candidates still remains open for debate . Law sues by a Japan lawyer, Hiroshi Miyauchi , ” while Japan spends a fortune on foreign aid to Muslim states , it doesn’t take in Muslim refugees, and for a good reason. Out of 5000 applications. Japan has yet to grant asylum to a single Syrian, presumably because it isn’t looking for welfare scrounger who will kill and rape in their spare time. But the Syrians aren’t taking it lying down.” In conclusion after, 9 million people have fled their homes from Syria , resulting in some actually, taking taking refuge within neighboring countries with thousands more fan-out across the world even, as far away as Japan, with consequences of encountering many road blocks. The world’s third- largest economy yet to grant asylum to an single Syrian. Why has little attention be given to Japan ‘s current circumstances regarding the current refugees status? At least, Slovakia is willing to assist and contribute to take in only, Christians in addition to recent reports of incidents of Muslims mistreating Christians one example, was a Islamist terrorism group extremists from Somalia hijacked a bus in Kenya ;s north on 11/2014 while heavy armed and holding passengers hostage from the bus that was unable to recite certain passages from the Qur’an then killing those that could not recite correctly, what was as a result.
    therefore, to answer the original question Asked”Are some EU countries wrong to only want Christian refugees? my answer is No and stop condemning Slovakia’s comments he only stated the truth regarding Mosques !

    • Joy Kilcollum

      Message above

  94. Vee Brame

    No they are smart. They know they will end up having tp fight these refugees before long because many are loyal to terrorism.

  95. Zambo

    Nice, my Christian family had to run away from Syria and Lebanon. Everyone gave us their back and now they want you infidels to take care of their mess and have them as neighbors. Good luck with that Europeans…

    • grace

      I am sorry you have had to experience and witness this.

  96. Adrian Limbidis

    THIS COMMENT WAS REMOVED BY MODERATORS FOR BREACHING OUR CODE OF CONDUCT. REPLIES MAY ALSO BE REMOVED.

  97. Nick the Greek

    Syrians are a biblical peoples and Europe should be safe refuge for them. The destruction of Syria displaced >4 Million peoples…most are housed in camps located in Turkey, Jordan and Lebanon. Turkish military operations along border area triggered mass exodus of peoples from there to Europe. And with the displaced Syrians trek economic-migrants and asylum-seekers in their multitudes.

  98. Felamongi

    From humanity sight, it seems horrible to reject the refugees but anyway EU countries have their own right to accept or reject as they are, of course, considering the impact on the country’s balance situation. It’s like you are coming to a house and asking for help but if the house owner refused to help you, would you really break into the house, force the owner to accept you and let you stay in?

  99. consolacion barcenas

    Christians, Yazidis, Kurds are bearing the brunt of the Muslim anger. It is but natural to give them priority. Many have been sold to slavery. Separate the gays from others and send them to America. Obama would be pleased.

    • Felamongi

      I spontaneously laughed when reading the last sentence

  100. If only you know!

    It is a different story if the refugees are Africans or say Asians but ARABS!!!!! European countries are making the biggest mistakes of their lives … People here are saying they are humans they should be treated equally with respect … May God bless your heart but be realistic … Muslims don’t have that same perspective … Don’t think about it now, picture the next 10 or 20 years when they increase and multiply … Your children will feel the heat when say a few become radical Muslims … I really fear the worst for Europe. They will force their religion down your throats … It’s their nature, that’s how they are … Anywhere in this world. When a Muslim converts to Christianity or any other religion, that’s about it … They just say fellowship with us n so on … But if u convert to Islam the 1st thing you MUST change your name … Why?!?!? … Think Europe! Think!!! These are the same people as ISiS just in a bad position if they where the ones in that position only God knows… I fear the worst for Europe.

    • If only you know!

      Look at their mosque? They put the speakers so loud they don’t, you must listen to their prayers … Go build a church in Saudi Arabia or in any Muslim country see what they will do to you … They will understands the kind acts now … But humans never remember the good act in a long run only the bad … The biggest mistake Europe ever made … Was watching some swedish people say … They are welcome …LMAO … Go to Saudi with ur blonde hair n see if you are welcome there … Muslims don’t care about kind acts … Esp these generation who happen to read the Quran upside down. I’m not bashing any religion or people … I respect all religion but Islam has lost it’s respect. When I don’t hear about terrorist trying to blow innocent people up everyday on the news … U get your respect back. But now …

    • Kate Calder

      See, I’ve never understood this argument.

      Why complain about how those other countries treat people if that’s how you want to treat people? They’re only doing what we’d be doing if it weren’t for these pesky Human Right things we’ve had foisted on us by the Evil Brussels Bureaucrats™

      If you thought Europe was better than those other countries, or that any given European state was better, you’d be demanding that we demonstrate it. If it’s not better, there’s no reason to be protective of it.

    • blugalf

      As much as I’m in favor of Human Rights, Western Civilization and the EU, this:

      “They’re only doing what we’d be doing if it weren’t for these pesky Human Right things we’ve had foisted on us by the Evil Brussels Bureaucrats™”

      is quite daring – don’t get me wrong, but it suggests the whole of Europe would immediately default to medieval ways and values if it weren’t for the European Declaration of Human Rights and the EU. That’s simply not true. Those rights are the culmination of 1000+ years of misery, endless periods of war, suffering, and blood-drenched soil (we call that ‘History’) as well Enlightenment, philosophical and scientific struggle and insight paid for by centuries of peril all over the continent. Sorry if all of this sounds overblown, but those are literally the foundation of today’s Europe. Not some printed articles ceremonially rubber-stamped and filed.

      I can only hope “these pesky Human Right things we’ve had foisted on us by the Evil Brussels Bureaucrats™” will eventually begin to carry a meaning for and be embraced by the people who come to Europe on those grounds. Often enough it doesn’t look like it, and based on what I’ve seen so far, I can’t easily dismiss the fear expressed by “let’s see what happens if you build a church in Saudi Arabia”. Доверяй, но проверяй, as Lenin had it.

    • Kate Calder

      I knew I should’ve marked the sarcasm with tags saying “Sarcasm”.

      My point was that this:

      “Go build a church in Saudi Arabia or in any Muslim country see what they will do to you …”

      … and this:

      “Go to Saudi with ur blonde hair n see if you are welcome there …”

      …are variants on an argument I keep on hearing over and over again in criticisms of ‘Muslim countries’ – the upshot being: “If you go to their country you’ll be treated badly so when they come here we shouldn’t treat them well.”

      (That’s passing over the egregiously simplistic – and usually highly anecdotal – claims about what’s likely to happen to you in those countries anyway.)

      If you accept that argument, and especially if you’re basing your personal foreign(er) policy on it, then you have to accept one of its huge flaws: you’re asserting a lower standard of morality in those other countries *and then implying that you think we should match it*. I don’t think we should – even if we take it as read that what’s said about those countries is always true. Even if that’s the case, I think *we* still have a duty to treat people with respect and dignity, and where possible, listen to their stories and give them a fair hearing.

      As for human rights, no: I don’t believe they’re pesky, or the whim of bureaucrats. Those are sentiments I often see packaged in with the same arguments: that we should do away with formalised human rights because they’re protecting the rights of people the commenter doesn’t like. Personally, I believe they’re a worthy attempt to lay down some of the most basic protections that everyone in a civilised society – whether resident or visitor – should be entitled to. They may not be perfectly worded; they may be exploited – but we’re a damn sight better off for having them than we’d be without them.

    • Blugalf

      No need for sarcam tags. Rest assured, I’ve invoked the Evil Bureaucrats more than once.

      However I think you were at most half joking, if not completely serious, about how we’d instantly revert to medieval standards if it weren’t for some legal barrier (whatever it may be called). That’s mainly what I took exception to. Laws tend to reflect the mindset of the people governed by them, not the other way round.

      It’s rather self-evident that we can’t apply different standards depending on where people come from. I fully got your point, and I wasn’t suggesting that at all. The question that has people worried and that I can’t easily dismiss is this: can we safely assume that people coming into Europe from these countries will actually embrace and accept our standards even when doing so conflicts massively with the standards they brought with them? Based on what I’ve seen in France and to some extent the UK, skepticism is indicated to say the least. People simply are worried to see that certain groups of immigrants make full use of the freedoms and rights granted them by our values, but are not always equally eager to accept the implications they have on their own ways.

      Yes, sometimes it’s simply xenophobia that is vented by the “churches in Saudi Arabia” type of argument. But there’s another level to it – often quite diffuse probably, but it boils down to this: aren’t our open societies ill equipped to deal with the influx of people for whom their values hold little significance?

  101. Profit Muhammad

    Oh yeah, here come the “fill in the blank-guilt” comments… I’ll start with few; White-Guilt, Nazi-Guilt, Colonialism-Guilt, Crusades-Guilt, NATO-Guilt, Jew-Guilt, Afghanistan War-Guilt, Iraq War-Guilt, etc.

    Keep it going… I want to see how many nonsense “guilts” we can build up to make the EU feel guilty about everything and anything they do.

  102. anony mous

    Nope….

    So, why don’t Muslim countries like Turkey, Saudi, or the rich Emirates take in their Muslim brethren with open arms?? Would someone please explain this to me? Because I don’t understand why. Why are these countries turning a blind eye, when the Western world is getting criticized for not accepting enough of them??
    That’s B.S.
    Fact is, Islam clashes with the Western world. and I don’t want to hear about Islamic refugees complaining about how liberal the western world is, and how it clashes with their religious ideologies and beliefs.

  103. Marcel

    The reactions from the eastern Europeans say it all.

    Its that moment you know it is over. In Roman Empire terms, the EU is in the year 470. In Soviet Union terms, its 1985. In the terms of the Russian/German/Ottoman/Austro-Hungarian empires its 1913.
    In the years mentioned, no one would have believed the empires in question would disappear. And yet they all did.

    The EU will, of course, linger. It might do so even a few decades, considering how much of our wealth politicians seem willing to sacrifice to keep it alive. But the game is up. The EU’s demise can be delayed, but it is inevitable.

    I will not miss the EU.

    And to a degree, we owe these migrants a debt. They’ve exposed how bankrupt the EU is in every way. And above all, how solidarity and unity are meaningless terms. The EU has never been so divided, both culturally and economically. And there are those who would try to make a federal state out of these countries? The longer you think about it, the more ludicrous the idea becomes.

    • Kate Calder

      And how grateful those people will be who want to live in a world of little tiny nations waving their little tiny flags, stamping their little tiny feet and keeping everyone else at arm’s length because, hey, they’re *foreigners*.

      Yes, the EU will die, and soon, I believe; and yes, it may well be this issue (partly of our making, let’s not forget) that kills it. And it will be a colossal step backwards for Europe and for humanity, to have given up so easily on unity.

      But sadly, narrow, mistrustful parochialism is what people want, and I’ve no doubt they will cling to it for a long time to come. Humans are sadly rather too good at thinking small.

  104. Peter Bryant

    No I don’t think some EU countries who want only Christian refugees is wrong.
    Europe was built on those original values but now things on the whole have changed and Europe is more secular and free from the religious indoctrination.
    But now we have the politicians running the agenda in Europe now. That’s why we have hundreds of thousands of un documenteded migrants marching across Europe in the hope of a better life many of whom are Muslims but lets just hope their future generations have the same secular ideology as most Europeans otherwise I think in a few decades Europe will be like Syria and the middle east. You only have to see what’s happening at the moment.

  105. Eugenia Natsoulidou

    The refugees were never welcomed in any place, not even among their own ethic groups! Unfortunately! Imagine now, for Europeans to accept so different people (by culture, religion, education, etc) in massive migration! It will not work, neither for Europeans nor for migrants.

    • Am

      True, I agree

  106. worriedman

    can Europe really cope with this.if the boot was on the other foot would the muslim states be welcoming us? all the people who are for welcoming them.think long and hard about your childrens futures .because the problems over there will come to are shores.they do not intergrate,form there own communitys and this is a big threat to are way of life.mark my words as soon as they outnumber us lets see if they are so loving and generous.so all you do gooders be warned in the future you and your family may end up on the receiving end of your decisions today.

    • Kate Calder

      Your ‘worries’ – let’s be charitable and call them ‘worries’ – are predicated on the popular if flawed assumption that these people are the perfidious vanguard of some conquering army of a hard-line caliphate.

      A moment’s thought should show how implausible that is. These are people fleeing the fighting and disruption of their homelands. Even with the lowest degree of human empathy, that’s not hard to understand. I’m pretty sure we’d all be doing much the same if it meant keeping ourselves and our families safe from similar upheaval here.

      The problems over there won’t come to our shores, but if we don’t learn some sympathy and communality with our fellow man, we’re certainly going to start creating problems of our own.

      We need to stop thinking in narrow, frightened terms. These are people. Dismissing me, or anyone else, as a ‘do-gooder’ doesn’t change that. And as human beings we have a choice: we either treat them with respect and dignity due all human beings, or we relinquish any right to point the finger at other countries as you do here.

    • blugalf

      “…these people are the perfidious vanguard of some conquering army of a hard-line caliphate. …”

      You attempt to ridicule a point with at least some validity by simply equalling it to a paranoid conspiracy theory that asserts an active agenda. Kind of cheap, although you might try to pass it off as -er- sarcasm. While there is of course no such agenda, there is definitely a problem with certain reglious minorities, their integration or lack thereof, into european societies and their ideas about the values of the countries they’re going to stay in. A problem which is unknown for other minorities and religions. It doesn’t matter where these people come from, and why they come here; their refugee status doesn’t alter their socialization, doesn’t change their often unfavorable views of our ideas and values, or give them a blank check of any kind. The solution is not to deny them help, but to ask if it’s really all /our/ fault that integrating them properly is going to be difficult.

  107. Sue

    I don’t understand why they want president Assad to go, Muslim countries need dictator not dimocracy.
    Look what happened after Kazzafe and Saddam gone.

    • EU reform- proactive

      @Sue- hi there!

      “I don’t understand why they want President Assad to go…..”? I also + many others!

      Save to say, that all SMART-ASS politicians will refuse an honest & direct answer! (Please excuse me praising these selfless politicians excessively!)

      Many (sensible) people- who are resistant to the highly infectious & dangerous ‘ego virus’ to which most “important” political leaders succumbed- by preaching a strange but THEIR (un) holy concept- are pondering for a very long time also- why, why, but why? A clue:

      The present American white house press spokesman (US’s “spin SMART-ASS No1″) recently answered (DEFLECTED) such question, (“on behalf of the whole US Administration and the “US people”?) by saying:

      ……..to answer such questions gives dignity to such a question which it does not deserve, therefore he cannot allow that to happen- (sic.- since it is undignified) – next question please! (Do we deserve these kind of bureaucrats & rulers?)

      Now,- simple people like us are left to ponder until political resurrection & have to draw our own conclusions- meaning, the US policy of “regime change” once decided becomes global- even universal & EU law as well- never to be questioned or challenged- as are any EU regulations or treaties on our continent! Both Suzerain’s are molded in the same mold & hued of the same wood! NWO!

  108. aitik

    Do you think Europe is preserving or forcing Christian cultural identity?

    • EU reform- proactive

      @Aitik
      First please specify what you mean & understand under “Europe”- is it its political and official stance of the ruling elite in Government & EC/EP or the ordinary populace & its voters- granted a choice every 5 years – or what?

    • grace

      Atik, I think what Europe has going for it is religious freedom….and they don’t want to lose that by having Muslims take over and enforce Islamic laws. You don’t think Muslims will take over. It will be pure mathmatics.
      1000 people go to the voting booths. 800 are Muslims. Guess what!

  109. TrueEuropean

    No muslim should be allowed into Europe. They should leave their religion at home and learn to respect european culture. If they really are fleeing from danger, it would be absurd to insist on religion in a secular mostly atheist continent.

    • Kate Calder

      The Europe you’re advocating there isn’t one I’ve ever had the misfortune to live in; nor is it one I would want to live in. There have been previous attempts to mandate state atheism. They did not end well. Requiring conformity to a non-religious viewpoint is no less damaging than requiring adherence to a specific religion.

      That said, I wouldn’t need to live in your Europe, because I’m a druid, so presumably I’d need to leave, too. As I was born in Britain, to Brits born of Brits, do you have any suggestions where I should go?

  110. Muhammad Ali

    Religion should not come into contact with basic human rights.

    • grace

      MA, nor should religion breed hatred, but history proves, time snd time again, it does. In Eutopia, I would welcome all religions….but then in Eutopia there would be no refugees fleeing war. The fact that wars go on show that in humans there will always be those who seek power and domination, and those who force others to accept their agendas. As much as we might want to live in Eutopia, we are just stupid and naive if we think it will be any other way. So anyone should be pardoned if they seek to defend a culture, country or say of life that they hold dear, when it is put at risk.

  111. Virgilio novo

    though I have my heart for the refugees the way I look at the situation, there is a great problem that will surely crop up in the future for taking in refugees by the host nation, and that is religion. Most refugees are muslim. When a Christian settles in a Muslim country, he should adopt the culture, behavior etc. Of the host country but when the Muslim settled in a host Christian country, the host should adopt the culture of the Muslim settler maybe not outright but in the years to come. You see the difference? A Christian cannot exercise his freedom of faith in muslim country but a Muslim can do what he want in Christian country.

    • grace

      VN, they aren’t even respecting immigration rules or the need for host countries to request some order. I can’t see them respecting anything else. Damn, you would think they would at least oblige the countries they want to enter by respecting their immigration procedures.

    • Kate Calder

      No: when a Christian settles in a Muslim country he should be free to believe whatever he wishes. Just as a Muslim should be free to believe whatever he wishes when he settles in a largely secular region like Europe.

      European citizens are assured freedom of religion: that applies even when the religion is one we might personally not share.

      But look, here’s this same argument again: “In Muslim countries they don’t let us do [insert whatever it is here], so we shouldn’t respect them/their rights.”

      That argument makes no sense. If you are happy to see Europe descend to the low standards you perceive in these other countries, then why complain about people coming here and bringing those standards?

    • chia maria

      @Kate. It’s not as simple as saying “they don’t respect us so we don’t respect them.” It’s not about being tit for tat or petty (though in all honesty why should I respect someone if they unfairly disrespect me? ). The issue goes way beyond that. EVEN if Europeans decided to be tolerant of Muslims it still wouldn’t work out because the Muslims would force their way of life onto their host countries once there’s enough of them. They wouldn’t allow Europeans to coexist peacefully with them. They don’t recognise nor appreciate tolerance and respect because that is not how the Muslims think. THIS is where Europeans are coming from when they say they won’t respect islam. Not because they are pretty but because they know that the alternative (ie. accepting) will be suicide. They are rejecting islam as a form of self preservation and everyone has a right to preserve themselves and their very existence. Why is that so hard for you to understand that? Get off your PC high horse.

  112. grace

    I think what Angela Murkell did was disgustingly heavy handed. To play the benefactor and say, “Welcome, all of you” one day, then turn around the next and pass the buck by demanding quotas for each country. If that is how the EU is going to function, then I pity Europe.
    I am amazed at the fortitude of politicians who are daring to be real about their concerns and stand firm to protect their own people/society to who they are first and foremost responsible.
    If I lived in Europ I would be voting no EU if it means being steam rolled by German politicians, or a few wealthier Euro countries.
    I live in Australia and I have seen the change that has happened since Islam has been allowed to get a toe hold, since Muslims have come in, and unlike the Vietnamese, Chinese and every other immigrant before them, demanded that Australia change to suit their religion and customs. It is a change for the worse because they have not respected Australian values and beliefs but demand we bow down to theirs.
    No thanks. No more Muslims. Not in a democratic country where they can multiply and vote. It’s simple logistics. Anyone but Muslims, peace-loving or otherwise. And wny voting I do from now on will reflect this stance.

  113. grace

    Would this be an issue if they were Buddhists? Would it be a problem if they were Hindu. Somehow I think not so much. It’s not religion but politics. Islam doesn’t separate faith and state.
    I hardly think it is Christianity that is really being defended but a what it has morphed into. We don’t want to be dominated by a religious or political ethos that would rob us of our freedoms.
    Check out Malaysia. Muslim government. All people born Muslim MUST remain Muslim and come under Islamic law. It has become progressively Islamic. 30 years ago no head covers. Now the Malay women all wear the kebab.

  114. TIm K

    Let other muslim countries to accept the refugees-their brothers and sisters. Europe already has big problems with Muslim population, just go to Great Britain, France, Belgium, Germany and some other countries. Muslims don’t integrate in non-muslim societies. I would suggest creating refugees camps. To force peace in Syria and move all the refugees who are claiming to be from Syria (even many came from different places) back there.

  115. grace

    I think the ‘welcoming someone needy into your home’ is a good one. Someone on here used it to argue for taking in refugees.
    But here is how I would operate in that situation:
    If I had children at home, their well being would take priority over helping others.
    The people wanting entry would need to ask, not break into my home.
    They would not be choosing which room they got, but would be allocated a room.
    They would be shown hospitality but be required to abide by house rules and contribute toward maintaining the home order.
    They would need to keep the house and their room clean.
    They would need to get along with other existing members of my home.
    I would not take in more than my home could manage.

    If I thought that taking people be detrimental to the happiness of my home, I would not allow them in, but rather say, “Here’s some money. Go get a room”.

    It’s tough to some but my first obligation is to my family. If I took in people who would would disrupt and not get along with my family or each other, no one will be happy.

    BTW, I can’t see refugees agreeing to be sent to countries that don’t want them. Not when they have it in their minds to go to Germany or the UK. So I think it won’t matter what European countries decide regarding distribution. The immigrants have already shown their determination to go where ever they will.

  116. Tim

    You take the people into your home and then won’t be able to do what you want in your home. How’s that? Islam and Christianity usually don’t mix together well. Many European countries already have big Muslim population. Giving big birth rate among Muslims and low birth rate among Europeans, Muslim will become majority in 20 or so years. Do we want that? Do we want them to dictate how we should live? It’s coming. Germany need more workers to pay for their aging population. But Muslim immigrants are bringing many problems, they don’t integrate well in German society. Just look at Turkish population there.

    • grace

      Tim, I agree with you 100%. The genie has been let out of the bottle and there will be hell to pay for it. Angela Merkel in particular has bee astoundingly foolish and heavy handed, jumping in and opening the flood-gates on immigration without giving proper respect to other EU nations by consulting them first. Then expecting them to help clean up the mess. She has not even considered that Germany’s infrastructure, roads, schools, hospitals, police force, etc will be ready for the population explosion.
      I have changed my mind completely on Greece’s debt crisis. I now think they should have been forgiven a great part of it, if not all. If you have money to throw at strangers, then you should be able to help your own first.
      It’s like if I left my own family in need but helped the person down the road. It doesn’t sit well.

  117. UK

    This is the end my friends, the end of Europe as we know it.

    If anyone in their right mind believes that such an influx of migrants in to Europe, won’t have a detrimental affect on us all, they must be absolutely bonkers. Any migration of people in the last 1 million years has shaped the landscape.
    If Angela Merkel wants to be a saint, so be it, but at the people of Europe’s cost. To open the borders to 1 million immigrants (maybe more) is beyond belief. That in fact is what she is doing . I, as an ex-soldier who has been in war zones knows; that the people who have lived in a war zone for a prolonged period of time have a very difficult time to adjust to any kind of normality for at least a year. To bring 100,000 people of a different way of thinking and culture, ‘mainly men of a fighting age I might add’, in to a western society is bordering on suicide.

    Why I may ask, have these men not stayed in there own countries and fought for there beliefs and freedom. Where are all the women and children? did they stay at home to fight Assad?

    What happens in Germany when all these ‘so called refugee’s’ realise that life in the west is not so rosy and finding a job is harder than they thought. What happens then? Do they turn to crime?, do they take out the hatred that Assad, etc. dished out to them on to the society that now houses them? do they set up ghetto’s with other desperate people of the same persuasion and therefore create an even bigger problem, and a bigger pool of would be extremists.

    What happens when the Syrian war is over, do we then tell these people that they have to return, no! of course not.

    Why not just give every male ‘aged between 17 and 60′ that arrives from Syria, a brand new AK 47, 1000 pounds, 10,000 rounds and a set of balls, and send him home to fight for his country, because I would need a lot less than that to fight for mine.

    I do say however, take in to Europe every woman and child that we can.

    • Chemime

      I agree with you whole heartedly, look what is happening in Germany now, Syrians are suing Germany for having to wait one week for benefits, this is the beginning of a mass problem, thanks to Merkel she has created a demon and we will all have to pay. These people will not integrate, they have no tolerance for any other religion. What strikes me that Germany did not win the last two wars, is this their way of defeating Europe financially?

      Most of these young men and women that appear to be healthy and capable, why are they not fighting for their own country, why should Europe cater to their needs, this is their doing not Europes?

  118. Nick Georgas

    Well one must remember that there is a historical fear of muslims in eastern europe brought upon by muslims themselves due to invasions and holy war during the ottoman empire!To the European mindset the problems in the mid east countries is because of the ethics of islam!The fear of islam is not a delusion though. It is an ideology that any sane person would be wary of!!History attests to muslims turning against their host countries! The coptic christians welcomed muslims in egypt .Today they are fighting for survival. And egypt is majority muslim now!.It used to be christian!Lebanon also welcomed muslims. It was a prosperous nation. But soon plunged into civil war as the muslim population increased!Lebanon has never recovered to its former self!If this same trend persists in europe civil strife is inevitable!

  119. Sousa Christina Adrianna

    I’m Christian but I do respect their religion !! …They Want to live in EU but don t want to change at all.I’m a Crusade ..EU People will not take that …and you all know it.So continue do your job nobody ask us about nothing before open the borders.Now afford it …

  120. Laszló Schilling

    I’m an European and Christian citizen, I respekt every religion and culture. But this Global and EU politicians manipulation tactic had passed all and every border!!!!. Without to respect even OURS-European citizens Human Rights! This EU Grupp who want and try to press all us.., it’s more than shame and unrespect for the whole European citizen! Please take place and start a new vote program and let first ask us about IT! It’s Time to show that the Europran Peoples don’t want to let and cutting all “trees” from theirs culture-religion-education -lifestyle..,

  121. Mariana Giozova

    I am Christian, i am EU citizen. I respect all. But the problem is that they do not respect us. They do not want our laws. They want islam to spread all over the world. Yesterday i saw some muslims in the middle east who killed christians in a church.it is very serious issue. Europe wake up!!!!

    • Dec

      The greatest human rights violation today is the persecution of minorities. Christians are the largest numbers by far.
      - Half of Iraqi Christians have fled rather than die or become apostate. Countless numbers of their churches have been destroyed.
      - Syrian towns that have been Christian for 2000 years are bein annihilated.
      -The 1300 year march of terror against the Copts continues in Egypt today.
      - Christians jailed in Iran are tortured.
      - Christians and Hindus are persecuted to near annihilation in Pakistan.

  122. Sonja Shah

    to quote “I am Christian and a EU citicizen, I respect all…BUT…” what kinds of racist uninformed idiots are commenting here??

  123. Joao Antonio Camoes

    The population demographic needs are completly dif from a country to another. Each country should be allowed to define what sort of population (age, origin, sex, families or not, etc) solve thier demogrphic problem.

  124. Geoffrey Howard

    Humans are humans. We Global Citizens do not differentiate between skin pigmentation, choices in food or theology. If people want to live the Westphalian misconception, Europe is not the place. That is history and WE are the future.

    • grace

      You think we are all humans thus all the same? Would you brutalize people and telish it? Could you? Could you decapitate someone and hold up their head for a selfie? Could you perhaps tie a baby by the legs, one leg to its mother, the other oeg to the father, then tear the oarents apart until the baby is torn in two? Perhaps you could bury a woman up to her waist in sand and join a group in stoning her to death for owning a phone. Or perhaps you would hand your 10yr old daughter over to marry an old man.
      Wake up! We are NOT the same!!!!!

  125. Jean-Jacques Eiza Lauture Descayrac

    This is not a question of religion but a question of tolerance. If there is a too large quota of intolerance, non educated people, there is a risk of regression of the whole society and fall into the same traps as we have elsewhere, this is contagion. On the contrary if people can bring their own “solidarity spirit”, absence of “greed” and positive energies when they have, it will bring solidarity absence of greed, be beneficial and will create a good synergy. There is a right to chose whom we want to host and nobody has the right to impose it, unless it is related to true refugees and martyrs families, this is to be demonstrated.

  126. Tsvetomir Grozdev

    All refugees to go in USA. USA is responsible for this crysis!!! USA wants to collaps the EU. Orban to replace Merkel!!!

    • grace

      Tell that to the MOSLEMS.

  127. Andrew Chandler

    I don’t think there should be discrimination on the grounds of religion. Perhaps the Saudis could find the funds to help build mosques.

    • Nick Georgas

      Should not the Saudis use the money to help the refugees like taking them in and housing them?? And not europe!

  128. George

    If you only want to accept Christian refugees then you are unequivocally not following in the example of Jesus Christ and are definitely not a Christian.
    Matthew 25:35 “For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me.

    • Nick Georgas

      George,you have a point but what it is also written be as wise as a serpent and as gentle as a dove,!! To help is one thing but if the one being helped has intentions for the worse thsn it is not a sin to reject this or those people.Assuming we could go back in time would anyone help humble hitler to rise from the bottom?

    • grace

      And beware of wolves in sheep’s clothing. Only these wolves no longer have to bother with the sheep’s clothing because pc protects them.

  129. Tin Knezevic

    It takes a strong man t help those in need. And a wise man to know to value other humans not on the basis of gender, race, religious views or similar lines, but on the merit of their actions and the kindness of their own deeds.

  130. Tin Knezevic

    It takes a strong man t help those in need. And a wise man to know to value other humans not on the basis of gender, race, religious views or similar lines, but on the merit of their actions and the kindness of their own deeds.

  131. Martin Bohle

    No preferential treatment because of religion, it’s part of ‘human rights’.

  132. Martin Bohle

    No preferential treatment because of religion, it’s part of ‘human rights’.

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  134. Linda Margaret Warnier

    Seriously? This is a debate? Does no one remember WWII? Some European countries wanted to stay Christian then – or a facsimile thereof. All the Christians I know follow the Golden Rule.

  135. grace

    Here’s a question. Muslims, and I mean that “vast majority of peace loving muslims”, get outraged at cartoon drawings of Mahomed, but we don’t seem to hear their outrage over:
    The stoning of women for things like being caught with a mobile phone
    Decapitations of journalists.
    Forced child marriages.
    The killing of children for attending schools.
    They go off their face over what they call blasphemy but seem to be silent when the violent 25% terrorize even people of their own faith.
    Come on you 75%. I only ever hear you justifying your religion. Where is your sense of perspective? Time for you to get OUTRAGED at what your other 25% are doing. And threatening to do.

  136. grace

    I mean fanatical minority……for now. Not if the fanatics get their way though, or if the “peaceful majority” do nothing but spout platitudes.

  137. Chemim

    What I would like to know, would any of the “do gooders” particularly members of any government offer their homes out in public to any Muslim refugee.

  138. Ingrid

    If some EU countries only want Christian refugees, could be because they feel that their culture would be at risk of being over run by the Muslim culture and/or due to their history? Who doesn’t know his/her own history is condemned to repeat it.
    I think that there is NO right or wrong here. The just question to ask is:” is it legitimate that some EU countries only accept Christian refugees?
    The moment one uses a pejorative wording like “wrong” in a sentence, that automatically gives the right to someone to judge and punish or condemn. It’s neurolanguistic programming and sets the tone for something negative when really the argument here is that everybody should be entitled to an opinion without judging or being judged as it is counterproductive. What is right for someone is inherently wrong for someone else so what do the use of such word accomplishes?

    • Ann

      Well said

  139. Nick Georgas

    Now that ISIS is on its way out due to Russian interference,the refugees can go home right??

  140. Bill

    The country is not wrong for wanting people of a religious faith that doesn’t promote destruction, abuse, or hostile takeovers of people

  141. Olivia

    I am mixed race and an atheist. I have a diverse family that includes Christians, Catholics and muslims. I love them all. However I do not feel guilty about saying I do not want an influx of muslim refugees here in the uk. In large numbers and from conservative countries I find that muslim values do not fit In well with our western values. In my experience muslims are culturally less likely to assimilate and more prone to making demands that we change our ways to suit them. I empathise with their situation but I think they would be more at home in a Muslim country, not here. I also find men from Muslim countries more intimidating than non-muslim men and it doesn’t help that so many of the refugees seem to be young, single men.

  142. VM

    In France, Britain and Belgium we are seeing second generation Muslims becoming more extreme than their parents. Even if the refugees today are grateful to live in Europe, there is the real risk of their children becoming a destructive force in the future.

    Muslims simply don’t value freedom because their very religion prevents them from separating church and state. For example, in Egypt’s first election the people voted for an Islamic fundamentalist. The recent Arab spring has not resulted in democracy…but it did give us ISIS (and yes, I know the U.S. is partially to blame for this by funding those lunatics). Even secular Turkey is now at risk of becoming more fundamentalist.

    I would never grant a Muslim citizenship in a democratic society. I know many good, hard working Muslims, and I bet everyone that has posted a comment in this forum has also. But what will happen when Muslims are the majority? The same thing that happens in most Islamic countries: goodbye freedom, hello sharia law.

    I believe that every democratic society has the right to refuse citizenship to people who are a risk to democracy, freedom of speech and freedom of religion. It just so happens that this means Muslims…not atheists or Christians or Buddhists or Hindus.

  143. Luke Nell

    Im white afrikaans, christian South African. The world pushed us into the hands of barbaric leaders and look at us today. White people are murdered everyday and this country went down the drain. A country who are christian and dont want muslims gets my vote. Fight for your country, people and religion or you will lose everything.

    • Am

      Sterkte, ik hoop dat het in de toekomst beter zal worden.

  144. P Reah

    For the past few hundred years christians follow the peaceful path – turn the other cheek, God is love ………etc. they have no political agenda.
    I am not speaking for politicians … They live in another world.
    Islam does not teach peace, converting to another religion is punishable by death, those of other religions are ‘infidels’, women are treated with disrespect unless covered up. In our cities the husband jaunts along with jeans, t shirt and trainers while his wife follows behind dressed in medieval clothes.
    There are many thousands of Christian refugees fleeing from islam, so why not accept those who not only flee from war but from islam too? I know who I would invite into my home and a country is just a larger home to the indigenous people.

  145. PG

    Well if many of the people who support Muslim migrants had ever lived in an Islamic country such as Malaysia or Indonesia as I have , they would understand the problem . In Islamic countries , Muslims have special privileges , all others are considered inferior , Muslims live to a large extent on subsidies and aid . Also Muslims cannot integrate into other cultures or countries , as it is forbidden by their religion , so any talk of integration is irrelevent .
    Also look at the problems of my country France with Muslim migrants , no-go zones , violence and crime and lack of integration of even 2nd and 3rd generation migrants and this is a decades old problem . Then look at the lack of integration of
    the Turks in Germany .
    Sorry to say people who refuse to fight for their rights in their countries , then come to the EU and demand rights , should be deported at once .

    • Tim K

      PG – very well said! European countries should preserve their culture and identity. Muslims are welcome to visit European countries but they should not immigrate here. Europe already got big problems, just look at Germany, France, UK, Belgium. etc.

  146. Lynne Clayton

    I want to know why Britain is only taking Muslim refugees. The camps in Syria are all Muslim, so by saying Britain is only taking refugees from the camps, David Cameron is turning his back on the Christians in the region. Muslims are not allowed to make slaves of other Muslims but young Christian girls from the ages of one to nine, fetch around $165 in the slave markets.

  147. Grace

    The fact that Christians are not welcome to join muslim terrorist organizations, that they are persecuted for their faith by muslims, should make it easy for a country to prefer to accommodate Christian refugees. By admitting thousands of muslim refugees, you are flipping a coin as to whether any of them are terrorists. Please don’t insult me by asking whether I am in danger of forgetting that all refugees are human. Of course they are. But I have not fallen into the trap that all humans can be perfected. There will always be savages, and to have them shoved down our throats en masse for the sake of cultural diversity is shear stupidity and cowardice; to wit, Barack Obama. The fact is that muslims do NOT share traditional Judeo-Christian values baked into western constitutional republics.

  148. PG

    Well the recent attacks in Paris should have answered all questions concerning
    uncontrolled immigration . Without security checks of individuals and verification of integration there will always be problems.
    Integration for Muslims is impossible are their religion forbids it

  149. Constance

    Stop the radical muslims coming go Europe please lets have a Euroes that is free of their ideals and cultural values, we don’t want them!!!

  150. Wilson

    On a scale of 1 to 100, ISIS (& other De-ranged crazy Islamists) are100 on the Richter scale but let’s not ignore the myriad social problems generated by Muslims who seek refuge in Western countries and then refuse to assimilate.

    Question …why haven’t Muslims ever called for Reform? Isn’t it time they did so they and the world might know the difference between so called ‘moderates’ and those wackos who embrace the fundamental radical ideology of the Koran?
    Certifying Imams
    Imams who seek refuge in the Western world should be certified so we can be sure they are not teaching a radical interpretation of Koran.
    Assimilation
    Muslims must assimilate; show respect for the host country or stay home. Religious wear (hijabs, niquabs, birkas, skull caps etc) should not be tolerated; rather religious wear should be relegated to mosques and home (behind closed doors) – not in public streets! Relgious wear on streets creates an environment of separation rather than inclusion; right off the bat lays the ground work for social problems. When I’m walking down the street, I want to know you are a German, a Brit, a Canadian etc – NOT a Muslim.
    Sharia Law
    Time Muslims wholeheartedly rejected medieval Sharia law. Sharia attracts control hungry men and psychopaths that want prestige and be somebody. It opens the door to crazies free wheeling doing hideous things to people – lashing, cutting of hands hands off etc etc. If you need guidance see a licensed counselor.
    Religion of Peace? …Where is the evidence?
    Muslims need to build a society that showcases peace. Currently they claim they are a religion of ‘peace’ but where is there evidence of this? Not one middle eastern/muslim country, city is peaceful. Outcomes matter – this points to the fact that there is something inherently flawed with the model from which they operate out of. Muslims need to take a hard look at their religion and take action to improve it so it may be in synch with human rights etc. Currently when we hear the word muslim; we associate it with trouble; muslims owe it to themselves and the world to change this.

    • Marc

      Well said will

  151. PG

    Countries have the sovereign right to decide who enters and who does not , and neither the UN , NGOs or the Eu Commission have the right to interfere . This interference is in fact eroding democracy , and needs to be stopped once and for all , before there are violent protests across the Eu , and governments fall , borders closed , and migrants told to return home .

  152. Wilson

    We must ask ourselves why Muslims who claim they are a religion of ‘peace’ show no evidence of this. Why is there no country or city that is a good place to live; peace-filled; where human rights are evident? This points to the fact that there is something inherently flawed with Islam. Time Muslims who claim they are ‘moderate’ got their head out of the sand and called for Reformation so they may distinguish themselves from the radicals. Overall, Islam is NOT compatible with democracy or Western values. Muslims clamor to countries established by Christians and overnight create social problems for the host country. It only takes a few bad apples – those who have a sense of entitlement – take and take and give crumbs back; who wear those hideous niqabs, birkas, hijabs and skull caps on our public streets. They are the trouble makers right off the bat – creating separation and with that laying the groundwork for prejudice. Religious wear in public should not be tolerated; Muslims wearing costumes in public are no ‘holier than anyone else; in fact this is the antithesis of ‘holiness/ wholesomeness’ – it shows disrespect. Most westerners find niqabs etc ugly and a symbol of oppression and all we dispise. The black adds no vibrancy to our society; no life; no joy. What makes it particularly disrespectful is the fact that Muslims are not mandated by the Koran to wear this garb. So those who do are defiant, insecure and the kind of people we don’t need in our society.

  153. Ivan Burrows

    .

    Given that German arrogance created the Schengen migrant crisis & most of the migrants only want to go to Germany the real question is:

    ‘Why should any other Nation take any migrants ?’

  154. Ivan Burrows

    .

    Given that German arrogance created the Schengen migrant crisis & most of the migrants only want to go to Germany the real question is:

    ‘Why should any other Nation take any migrants ?’

  155. Tuija Mustonen

    Right or wrong? They have the right to be either. Like all of us. My opinion is, that although many Lutheran religious people i have met are amazingly good and do positive contructive work for the society, anyone can be like that. Many muslims are like that, too, work sincerely for better. So in my opinion those countries that accept only Christian refugees have the right to do so, but IMO it is not right in the Christian sense.

  156. Mustafa Cezar

    Common immigration policy has collapsed it was a mistake from the beginning. If Germany wants to take 1 million asylum seekers due to their aging population it’s their problem. Turkey played the refugee card very well, they got visa free movement and 4 bn euro. I wish EU good luck with 3 million refugees and millions of one way ticket Turkish ‘tourists’.

  157. Sebastien Chopin

    They are criminal and don’t belong in the EU …as by doing that they go against the european ideal and in fine prevent its proper construction.. They are the enemy within as we’d say… but there are many nationals in Europe who have not yet understood where they’re at… and continue behaving primitively…. it is up to to the multi passports (by that I mean with more than one nationality) or real europeans to lead them forth..
    Because they don’t know what they’re doing and their leaders let them down under popular pressure rather than respect life and common sense…
    But this always ends up being the case when lazy idiots who don’t give themselves a fighting chance on the job markets are allowed to vote… as we may see in France today…

  158. Valentin Nebunescu

    It was wrong to relaxe the policy related to Turkey.The future will show to the EC how bad was this measure.

  159. Ivan Kovač

    Omg, why do you even bother with long comments when it’s an open and shut case. Are there Christian or secular countries in Europe? There.

  160. João de Oliveira

    Difficult to say because there are also Christians fanatics and everything else … But the issue is religion fanatics doesn’t matter what …

  161. Mario Kurzio Scortichini

    We welcomed so far even way too many migrants. Now the rest of the world should deal with this emergency. At the end of 2015 we still have no idea why only Europe has been called to cope with this situation.

  162. José Bessa da Silva

    Those are not criminals, at least not the majority. The problem is not their religion and who sees a problem in that is as good as any religious radical, but one thing is true, they are not refugees either, they are immigrants and they are looking for better economical stability, so lets us just start calling the bulls by their names (as my people say). Why are they refusing to stay in Greece, Hungary, etc? Why all of them want to go to Germany or Sweden? Money! Again, they are immigrants and should betreated as such.

  163. Chris Alexander Zervas

    ~ Please do everything to STOP the “unfair- no-cause- war ” and then we talk… ABOUT RELIGIONS WHO IS AND HOW THEY BECOME REFUGEES etc, etc

  164. Jude De Froissard

    Seing the results of some countries….you should judge by yourselves.. …but don’t forget that peoples like to live in their own country. .and that the enemy of this possibility is called intolerance.

  165. Franck Néo Legon

    close the borders, stop waging wars by funding opposants, we need peace on our borders, each one shall be master of its own land, stop the false “war for democracy” logic.

  166. Pan Sol

    Europe hypocrisy, nobody says the truth, because Europe and Turkey make them refugees, and now refuse them because of their religion, why they didn’t thing their religion before

  167. Cesar Coll

    What is the goal? If it is to help the MOST people with the available BUDGET, then yes, it makes sense to choose those refugees who would have an easier time integrating. And, like it or not, a lot of people wont hire/integrate muslims (whether that’s moral, is another debate).

  168. Enric Mestres Girbal

    From Cyprus to Iceland and from Gibraltar to Finland our roots are christian…now european politics are opening the doors to muslims, forgeting turks and arab’ s dream is to conquer the continent.

  169. Zoltan Kiss

    No, they are not. Islam is not compatible with Europe and our way of life. There’s no need for any more ghettos, sharia police and no-go zones in major European cities. It was a huge mistake to let them in in past decades in the first place. It’s about time to return to responsible politics.

  170. Emma Guess

    Yes. Who are they to decide who deserves to be safe nd who doesn’t? The questions on this page are really rubbish, bordering racist in general, I’m better out. ciao

  171. Ioanna Geor

    yes they are wrong in many ways: they fail their religion, they fail the spirit of multiculture existence and even the own principles of EU.If they seperate refugees, what stops them from seperating Eu members?

  172. Kristijonas Puzarauskas

    Well it’s not wrong as long as people feel the need to be safe. It is a very difficult time for humanity, because there’s a lot of situations where a wrong is more appropriate than a right. And there is a very thin line between them.
    The fact that no one got ready for this type of crisis doesn’t make it easier.
    I think the problem here is more cultural. People fear what they don’t know. Christianity in Europe is a safe choice, cause we have lived with it for a long time and nothing causes a big disaster as we feel safe. Now, whole Europe has a big problem with integration. Intergrating such a fudamental thing into today’s culture is difficult.. Especially, when the image of a religion is portrait in a such way..

  173. Rui Duarte

    Cristians were 20% of the population of the middle-east in the early XIXth century; christians are now being freightened and harrassed and all but extinct. There is a name for that: ethnic cleansing. Does it seem intelligent to wellcome, IN EUROPE, the same populations that are decimating, raping, enslaving and persecuting christians in the middle-east?

    • Paulo Mendes

      So where are today the Muslims that existed prior to Portugal and Spain and Andalusia? That ethnic cleasing looks more like cultural assimilation.

  174. Andrew Chandler

    They are within their rights to request that Christians should be resettled as a priority, but not exclusively. If Muslims want to settle in Hungary, for example, why shouldn’t they do so?

  175. Keith Mallia-Milanes

    Yes, those EU countries that only want Christian refugees are wrong.

  176. Dimitar Trendafilov

    Apparently not reason with their rigid multicultural liberal brains:

    Islam Earth is divided into two – the land of Islam and land of Jihad – the land of Christians and unbelievers. They come not to accept the European way of life, and to establish their – Islam … Islam exists only through violence and it shows wherever there are Muslims.

  177. Irena Leibovici

    The real refugees, mothers and fathers with children, obviously coming in Europe to save their family, should be helped. I am sure that even the citizens will agree toi have some of them in each town or village! Christian or any other religion, this is not more important, but for sure Christians shall be better integrated…

  178. Luis Raposo

    Terrorism and Troian tell something to the europeans, they have fear very fear, and it is natural…

  179. Björn Eric Ingemar Grahn

    yes very so aas canada is wery wrong only to take in refugees thats have education in work that they cant fill with canadians, Besides its all the same anyway.

  180. Sherrie Heckendorn

    It’s sad and disgusting to discriminate based on religion. All three religions are Abraham religions and all believe in jesus- just saying….

  181. Muscas Anne

    They want legal eager for work educated, respectful, which the majority aren’t. Are illegal from unknown countries charging in, raping and robbing.get the army of Europe!!! Point fingers at Turks the root of all disaster!! Most are not asylum seekers and cone from Turkey where there’s no war! Libya as well , Africans who are unidentified. This is a shame for Europe Merkel failed, CAMERON , Hollande, instead of encouraging closing borders grab those people, get the EU army and Navy …. Really why it hasn’t been guarding EU borders!!!!!

  182. Viviana Piedade

    Vamos não esquecer que os Cristãos também mataram muitas pessoas no tempo da inquisição. Não sejamos hipócritas! Vamos antes questionar-nos porque é que as pessoas se deixam seduzir por ideologias extremistas e como evitar. Falta de educação/ conhecimento , crise financeira, …. ?

  183. Ciobîcă Ovidiu

    That’s the most stupid question I have heard in a long while…but if it’s really waiting for an answer, I must say it…but with another question: It is wrong to be a racist? How could this nonsense ever be right?

  184. Terri Crispin

    “Open the borders”? – is that an order??!?!?!?!?
    We have to obey you?!?!? For you to come over and blow us up?!?!? F:;::;()) off !!!!!!

    • Maria Heib

      Thats a very interesting question.I don’t think that anybody has aggressive feelings against Muslims.But concider this: Hungary and Greece and a big part of old Yuoslavia were over centuries under Turkish occupation.Their unforgivable behaviour was not the religion, because the nations were allowed to practice their religions, but the unfortunate stillstand of culture. The ruling class was only interested in the punctual payment of the taxes, evrything else they didn’t care.
      So this countries were sleeping like the Sleeping Beaty and nothing Of relevence happened for ages.No Renaissance, only the Greek Orthodox Church did their best to keep language and religion alive.
      I wonder why all these muslime refugees come to Europe.From Afghanistan there are many other muslim countries on their way.Persia is another muslim country,but no refugee wants to live under this Mullah regeme. And the rich Oilcountries at the Gulf don’t want to waste their oilmoney on their “brothers”.So poor old Europe gets them all.I am teaching them voluntaraly German and they are like my children to me.

      Muslims

  185. Doru Adonis Izuel

    Haters gonna hate anyway, so no more bullcrap ! Most of them said Christian, because they had to say something … but they will still be hated because they are foreigners, Syrians, Iraqui’s, Afghans, etc. That should also not stop Europe from trying to make them adapt and assimilate into the culture of those member states they wish to live ! If they fail to adapt, they should be sent back to their place of origin.

  186. Anonymous

    Some of you may not realize but Muslims are not ISIS. In Islam, killing a person who ISN’T Muslim is considered a Non-Muslim, and ISIS is killing whoever they like. So STOP holding Muslims accountable for the deaths that ISIS is responsible for. Syrians don’t have a home right now, they are seeking for refuge, if you were in their shoes, you would not want to feel anything other than a warm welcome and some shelter. Maybe you should have a moment in their shoes before judging whether they are terrorists or not.

  187. Ethan

    Muslims make up .9% of the population but make up about 7 percent of the terror attacks. That is a 7X rate of criminality. We need to focus on getting the current ones to assimilate, not bringing more in. If you bring more in, they are less likely to assimilate, and the incidents of terror will increase and the rate of terror will also increase.

  188. Nikos Themelis

    If you say “i am a christian” and then discriminate others based on their religion,ethnicity,race,gender,sexuality, then you are no christian at all.

    If you say ” i am a christian nation,i want only christian refugees” then you aren’t a christian nation but a bigoted racist nation.
    And you ought to open the New Testament to read the teaching of Jesus to understand what christianity is about.
    To a christian,it shouldn’t matter if the person in need is muslim,hindu,atheist,woman,man,child,black,yellow,red,white,straight,gay, short or tall.
    To a christian,it should matter that a person in need is a person that needs help and the christian should help that person. That is basic christianity and human decency and compassion.
    If exclude people of your help complaining about their gender,faith or other attributes, then you are not christian but a pathetic human being.

  189. Nikos Themelis

    It is really inexplicable to me,that in Northern Europe particularly they think so much in a black and white way.
    I don’t understand how a person that claims to be christian can say with a straight face “i will help only christians”.By saying that he/she shows a true lack of understanding of what christianity is about,the basic teaching of the faith.

    • xena

      truth!

    • grace

      I would help non Christians, but not people of a religion that stoned people to death, decapitated, cut little girls’ genitals, hated and looked down on unbelievers, and believed the whole world should accept their religion or be killed. Nope. Those ones would not be welcome. I would accept non Christians, just not moslems.

  190. Ethan

    It is a simple question. Do you want to live in low crime society or do you want to adhere to some ideal that will lead to dangers? you can look up crime stats and it is blatantly obvious that the people from the Mid East and Africa do not assimilate into the European countries. An Englishman in Sweden may never assimilate and not speak the language well, but the dangers from 3rd world migrants are clear:

  191. Kovács János

    An oversimplification of this matter… but let’s reverse the question: “Are some EU countries right when they build parallel societies (with low success in the field of social integration)”? Multiculturalism has failed. Every state has the right to keep it’s own culture and traditions. However there are international conventions – must be observed. Another point: ‘migrants’ and ‘refugees’ are not the same.

  192. Ferenc Lázár

    I would reverse the question- would the wealthy Dubai, Saud-arabia take some liberal refugees from Europe and give them all the rights of gay marriage, nudism etc.?! Why is only Europe forced to take millions?!

  193. Martin Georgiev

    Better change the name of the group from “Debating Europe” into “Debating Arabia” than asking meaningful, racist comments towards the normal European citizens. At least then some people will understand of the Antieuropean politic the European Union is leading Europe into. If you are so desperate for having refugees, then all the European Politics and others can take home and divide the 1 million migrants and pay for them with their own money, not the money they are stealing from the ordinary working European.

  194. Maria Galgau

    The majority of Europeans would have no problem in helping refugees like children, women, old people or young but honorable people, whatever the religion… The problem is that those are hardly a 10% -15% of the ones that come, the other approx 90% are a big mess (whatever the religion)..

  195. Enric Mestres Girbal

    No, people (countries) can invite whoever they want. Besides, catholics have no other countries to seak refuge whilst muslims have a lot around where they come from.

  196. Enric Mestres Girbal

    Europe made a mistake allowing everybody in….refugge should be given to families with children, women and old men (like in Canada)….no to young men that will bring trouble.

  197. Dragos Jovanovic

    It’s still cruel Ed Cocks, we’re all human, and those government choices not only promote negative statutes of a country, but can also create violence on the borders. Bad choice. There are better solutions.

  198. Jean-Jacques Eiza Lauture

    Ce qu’il faut surtout c’est de ne pas cacher dans la presse les crimes et la lâcheté flagrante environnante de certains regroupements de nature communautaires. Nous n’avons pas fait tout ce parcours européen jusqu’au philosophes des lumières pour maintenant régresser aux ages les plus obscurs, de la haine, du sexisme, de la violence lâche et gratuite et donc vers un abrutissement le plus atavique qui puisse exister. Utilisons notre intelligence et notre savoir faire pour éviter tout cela. les medias doivent nous aider à cela. http://www.valeursactuelles.com/societe/alain-finkielkraut-decerner-le-prix-de-la-soumission-a-la-maire-de-cologne-58398

    • grace

      Jean-Jaques, I can only sort of guess at what you wrote and would like to express my sympathy to France. My husband and I visited you beautiful country (from Australia) for 3 months in 2015. What a stunningly beautiful and amazing place. But we already saw the beginnings of it being gradually taken over by illegal immigrants who clearly do not know how to appreciate it or look after it. My heart breaks at the thought of going back to see more of the result of merkel’s open invitation.

  199. Nicol Amina

    im not rasist,i love people,but i no want they in my country,i no want they in EUROPE,,,,,,,more from them are just some animals,what no know what means respect for women,civilization,and culture

  200. Ariste Arvanitides

    Νο, the refugees are being used to give free entry to ISLAMIST TERRORISTS that are designing the downfall of the free world, in order to impose their SHARIA. It is time for Europe to wake up, and shape up, and protect the freedom of the WEST.

  201. grace

    Every time you hear the UN talking about the plight of a people, it’s always muslims. Always muslims. Like the starving Hindus, or persecuted Christians in muslim countries don’t exist. And what we end up seeing is thousands upon thousands of angry, able bodied, fighting aged, unskilled muslim men demanding everything from free housing, to mosques and sex with European girls, and commiting crimes and expecting to use their ignorance to get let off without punishment.

  202. kriss kross

    that’s what u get when u don’t vet refugees …radicals muslims want to take europe and the whole world…usa also should stop invading muslims countries which haven’t attacked it…let muslims sort their own problems.

  203. xena

    whoever sows weapons, poverty, exploitation and war will reap refugees!

    • Jordan

      The middle east has been corrupt long before 9/11 and interventions by the west. Read the history and see for yourself that Muslims have never been able to establish a peaceful country or city anywhere in the world in the centuries that they have been around for. This speaks volumes.

  204. grace

    Would Granny have been wrong to not let in The Big Bad Wolf?
    Was Red Riding Hood wrong to notice he had big teeth?

  205. John Constantine

    Hi. I find that anytime there has been a civil unrest or war in Islamic state countries Christian countries seem to be regarded as the help for their refugees. This does not however take place when there is civil unrest affecting non-Muslims in Islamic state countries. Non Muslims are persecuted. Asking for Christian refugees makes sense because they will be integrated almost immediately. However Muslims pose various threats to established order.why not let Islamic state countries uninvolved in the conflict take Muslim refugees where they will integrate into their system immediately?

  206. Jordan

    It’s insanity to allow a culture into an established healthy society whose values go contrary to democracy. The majority of those from the middle eastern culture does not share western values or believe in democracy. The model from which they operate from (Islam / koran) is one that clouds their thinking and what gives rise to cultural conflict that will only grow with time. We would be wise to not let them in – rather help them establish peace within their own countries that are riddled with corruption. Those that are allowed in should be educated on our system of beliefs and should assimilate and add value rather than be on the receiving end. No hijabs, birkas, skull caps or any religious wear in public should be tolerated. This sets the stage for massive social problems. Muslims must show respect and wear their religion in their hearts and NOT on their heads. When I walk down the street I don’t want to know you are Muslim – I want you know you are Canadian or Australian (whatever kind host country took you in). Better yet – learn from your host country and go back home to establish a country of peace for your selves as Christians have done.

  207. BD

    Reading through the comments to this ubiquitous yet thought-evoking question has left me sitting behind my computer in silence.
    How can humans be so inhumane?
    Some may call my attitude emotional, I call it realistic.
    If one were to speak based on facts and not mere corrupt opinions, they would see that the largest deaths caused by ISIS are not in fact upon westerners, or Christians, or Europeans…but upon Muslims (mainly from countries that they are based in such as Syria).
    Now why is this? Because they are EXTREMISTS (kinda in the name). They are not normal, or average, or common Muslims. They are extremists who also happen to be Muslims.
    Islam is as much to do with ISIS as Christianity is to the with the KKK.
    I am not defending terrorists, I condemn them with all my mind no matter what religion or cause they work for. I am defending humans, who flee terrorists only to face vexatious people who (out of their lack of knowledge) suspect them to be terrorists also.
    Let me leave you with one question…
    Say I was to murder a person, or even to bomb a whole city, and said I was doing it in the name of Mickey Mouse. Who would be condemned for it? Me or Mickey?
    Similarly, if a terrorist is savage enough to kill a fellow human being, they are evil, not the Allah that they claim their actions to be in the name of.
    (P.S. before saying something stupid like “violence is in the Quran”, go and try reading it (if you are smart enough to learn one of the world’s most complex/ancient languages which you probably are not considering intelligent people don’t make such iniquitous comments. And only then will you see that it isn’t).
    To the cognizant few, thank you. To the ignorant many go and educate yourselves by watching this video http://www.ted.com/talks/dalia_mogahed_what_do_you_think_when_you_look_at_me
    You’re welcome.

    • Ethan

      Your attitude is pure emotion. Why is more muslim terrorism in the mid east? It is because thats where the most muslims are. The more of them you have, the greater it will be. The coverups by the police in germany, sweden, and elsewhere in Europe where rapes and murders have been suppressed to artificially lower the muslim crime rate is well known. You speak of compassion, but what of compassion for your women and children? Western polities are becoming police states because of the increased criminality because of muslim immigration. This is not an issue of “we are all human” but an issue of importing a violent culture into the west. You speak of blame, but it is the ideology itself to blame. It would be funny if not so insane. States banned the confederate flag after a kid shot up a black church but we will not ban the koran after muslim terror attacks? To millions of that culture, your people will face greater attacks and will either be forced to submit to islam or you will have to violently throw them out. Best for all to not import at all.
      Islam has always been more violent:
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_To-cV94Bo
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_Qpy0mXg8Y

    • Joseph Daniels

      Islam has many faces and all contribute to inflict evil to rest of human kind more specially to Christians and Jews, people of God and also rest of humanity because they are God’s creation. This makes plain it opposes God through lies, hypocrisy, deceit, theft, rape and murder, control and capture of the land and world control. West has turned away from God by turning to various philosophies thinking of its own mind and therefore has fallen in clutches of forces against God. But sooner it will awaken from its swoon and cut off its shackles and turn to God just as Spain did after 3 hundred years of domination of Islam.

    • P. Morgan

      Hi. No, the hunt has been on for Christian blood. Not that this has anything to do with the question. Yes, ISIL have killed muslims and those from other religious minorities too but it is Christians in particular that they have posed the question: “Die or convert”. If the Christians were lucky, they would be asked:” Stay and convert or leave.” Check out ‘Aid To The Church In Need’ for details. Thanks.

  208. Joseph Daniels

    Britain’s flagship automobile is owned and headed by the Indians, America is in debt from toe onward to the Chinese all you have left is the Bomb. You need population you can untap your own resources and accept you were wrong in playing God’s part, He is the provider, human wisdom only created fear and distraction. Russia is not your enemy but Islam is; you are nursing a snake. Why don’t Soudia support. Yes they are not Christian and so are you. Truth of the matter is West supported Isis so that it may import population, otherwise why would homeless refugee for your help would jump over your head and dance, kick, mock and rape and beat innocent girls and police cannot charge them and judges cannot punish them. Good luck.

  209. Gabriel

    Earlier this year, 10’000 refugee children were reported to have gone missing in the EU. What’s happening to them?

  210. Tony Fuff

    This is a very contentious and emotive subject however in history almost every country in the world has fought wars to maintain its social, cultural, religious and yes even ethnic identity. Therefore it would be plain ludicrous for any country to allow immigration with no control, Especially when a large number of those immigrants are of a different culture or religion. If indeed a larger conflict than that in Syria exploded in Muslim countries there could be an influx of tens of millions of refugees which would change the identity of many European countries overnight.

    What is going on here is the fundamental question of whether Christian countries have the right to exist. If they do not then they do not have the right to stop any immigration of other cultures and religions inside their borders. For those that are arguing for no control are in fact announcing that Christianity is in fact expendable by way of its very dictates. CHARITY. Now isn’t that the ultimate irony.

    It is my belief that countries do have the right to maintain control of their cultural identity. Can anyone name for me a Muslim country that encourages Christians to emigrate there to add to their cultural and religious diversity. Perhaps funding the building of churches and encouraging Christians to take part in politics in their country. I think not, the only figures I could find were to do with the 100,000 Christians who have been murdered in Muslim countries over the last few years and the number of kidnappings of Christians that have occurred. A topic that is apparently being ignored by even the Christian organisations around the world. Yes they are on the run too.

    The other question that needs to be considered is what level of assistance however dated to give to refugees. Should we be allowing them to settle in their millions inside each country they arrive at, year in year out, or perhaps fund refugee camps within the borders of their countries with regular assistance and finally allowing them to resettle their own country when we have helped to sort things out there. In the next ten years Africa alone could pour a hundred million refugees into Europe. Asia another hundred million. Can you even begin to realise what effect that would have on the culture and finances of European countries.

    People talk as if the crisis is over and the people within the European borders are all the people that need to be resettled. However anybody in their right mind can clearly see that this is just the beginning, the first trickling of a future tidal wave.

    To those people I say think carefully before you give the future of your children away. In your lifetime your country could change beyond recognition and your lives could be irreparably decimated.

  211. Keith De Souza

    Yes. Muslims must be kept away as they are as big nuisance like any horrible disease. They come to Europe and expect everything to change according to what they want. They want the Sharia (Excuse me till I puke) law. These refugees do not deserve any help from the Christian countries. Because all they want is to transform our Christian countries into the garbage lands they come from. They wont succeed since our Almighty Lord Jesus Christ and his heavenly army will fight for us and destroy these radical muslims. My message to the refugees- If you come to Europe in a hope to transform our lands into the areas similar to what you prefer, fuck off to your own country or to some other muslim country.

  212. Joseph Daniels

    Look the the Muslim Mayor of London, all muslims were united in voting to take of the control not for serving Londoners and the first statement this man makes is about Muslims against the presidential candidates of USA and call him ignorant. How could he be called ignorant in face glaring reality of atrocities happening from the Muslims against weaker minorities. Is he Mayor of London or representative of Muslims. English people are helping Islam, they should too be kicked out of Europe. They want to stay in the community only if they are gaining benefit and not for the unity of Europe. In the first place Degaule president of France did want them in but they forces their way in, now they should be forces out otherwise they will spread Islam in Europe too.

  213. Philip Morgan

    Hi. I don’t think it is wrong in the sense that many see Christians as being more peaceable. But I think all people need to be considered worthy of help for the very fact that they are human beings, and we, if in their situation, would wish to be treated with charity. It is a logical deduction on the part of many who study the fruits of Christianity and that of other religions to evaluate a safer gamble being to accept Christians because ISIL members were not recruited from the Christian populace. I don’t think we can turn our backs, however, on other people purely on this basis as this can turn into prejudice. Is it politically wrong: not necessarily; is it morally wrong, and naive; possibly. Thanks.

    • Jordan

      Muslims claim that Islam is a religion of peace. If this is so why is there no outward evidence of this? Not 1 peace-filled city or country to be found anywhere. Rather, Muslims flee to countries established by Christians. A good part of their problem is they have NEVER called for reformation – its centuries overdue. Christians have evolved over time; not so with Muslims. Islam prescribes a life from morning to night they are told how to live, on the prayer mat 5 times a day, wearing medieval garb, not allowed to express music, beauty or joy; no theaters to be found in the Middle East; women are not allowed to drive; they regularly flog people, stone and behead; women and children are looked upon like they are property. Human rights is non-existent. Introducing such a culture into the West without any pre-requisite is dangerous for all of us and Muslims too. We would help them enormously if we put some rules in place (as they do for us when we are in the Middle East).

  214. Joseph Daniels

    You already have enough Muslims towards whom you been excessively charitable and you have seen the outcome of it: rape, beatings of members of your innocent public, demanding more and pressurising your resources. Your are very conscience of prejudice against Muslim at the expense of barring any protection and hospitality to Christians who have no where to turn to. This is hypocrisy. But they will neither beg or demand, they have their Lord to sustain and protect them. Amen

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